h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Anyone who has suffered from the above and wants to chat, hi! My stuff is child sexual abuse from dad between ages of 11 to 16, now 31 and still trying to recover.

Hi, Kaz! Don't know how good a job I'll do of talking about things, but I think I'd like to.

I guess I'm one of the fortunate ones, I wasn't put through any sexual torture as a child. I just had the bad luck to be the spitting image of my mother, who hated herself so much that she took it out on me every chance she got. I'm a long way off from recovery, I've barely even begun to face the problem yet rather than accepting it as a sad fact of life.

I honestly can't remember when was the first time my mother hit me, although it continued on until I was injured so badly, I was placed in foster care at age 13. (I remained a ward of the court until I got myself emancipated at 16 and moved out on my own.)

Mostly I remember getting into a lot of trouble in school, as staying after school for detention delayed the inevitable beating I would get when I got home. I always knew I'd get one, even if I had done anything wrong yet that day. The only thing I needed to do to warrant punishment was exist. There's no feeling in the world quite like being terrified to go home, is there?

She claims it was uncontrollable rage, but at times I wonder, if that was true, how she had the presence of mind to not leave 'visible' injuries, at least not until much later on. Didn't take long to figure out that crying only made it worse, the best thing to do was take it in silence, then go to my room and stay there. Sometimes she'd even let me eat first.

What hurt the most wasn't being grabbed by the hair and punched or kicked in the back, or hit with whatever was handy, until she saw blood. It was after it was finished, seeing her holding my younger sister on her lap, brushing her hair, talking baby talk to her and giving her candies and stuff.

She's apologised, said she was taking out her self-loathing on me, yadda yadda yadda. Funny thing is, I can forgive her for that, but it doesn't change the fact that while the woman gave birth to me, I feel as if I haven't got a mother at all. And I resent her for that. Hating yourself doesn't give you the right to make someone else's life hell, I don't care who you are. And you know, while my father never laid a hand on me in my life, I resent the fact that he made himself scarce, rather than making her get help, putting a stop to things before I wound up hospitalized and was finally sent off to a foster home.

OK, I apologise for the epic tirade. I so hate whining about things, as if I'm the only one who's ever suffered or something. But it feels kind of good to let it out sometimes.

Thanks for that psychocandy, it sounded terrible, to be hit because you looked like your mother. I am right in thinking that you have managed to move on from there, as you sound quite okayish about it, as though you have managed to come to terms with it as much as you can. If thats the case then well done, and even if it isn't well done anyway. We survived everything which was thrown at us, and we are here to tell the tale!

Sometimes I think I'm okay, sometimes not. But as long as we hold on to the will to survive, I think the battle is half won. The coming to terms part isn't so hard. It's trying to convince yourself that you didn't deserve it, that you're not defective or worthless, and that you deserve to be loved and happy that's the tough part.

I wonder if I've really managed to move on, or if I've just been stifling things all these years in hopes that if I refuse to deal with them, they'll cease to exist. Either way, I'm glad I've finally gotten to the point, at 31 years old, where I can talk about it without feeling guilty and ashamed of myself.

I think that if you want to survive that is half the battle, for a long time I didn't want to. Its difficult to tell just how healed we are, whether we have moved on or not, I guess we should just keep going!

I am at the point where I don't want to talk about what happened so much anymore, all it does is stir things up and make me cry. My problem is now, I think I am better off having them in my life then not, but memories are difficult and I really resent having to be nice to my abuser. Are you in contact with your mother?

We are both 31! May we both continue to heal and grow and have a laugh!

I've been in contact with my mother over the past few years, although I've been standing back a bit lately. When I was in foster care, my parents were allowed some contact- phone calls, supervised visits, etc. My mother never phoned or visited.

I didn't see or speak to her again until I was 23, when I got married. I'd invited her to the wedding out of common courtesy, and she came. She did speak to me shortly thereafter, telling me she knew she'd been a bad mother, and she was sorry that she'd hurt me. Having given it some thought, taking into consideration the fact that my mother KNOWS what she did was wrong and can admit it, and deciding that a grudge is a heavy weight to bear, I told her something along the lines of 'no harm, no foul', and we've had regular contact since. She was downright kind to me when my husband was killed in 1996.

Problem is that while I had myself convinced that there was no harm done, and could even fool my shrinks into thinking I've been making progress, the truth is I've just been denying the extent to which I've been damaged. I don't *want* to have anything wrong with me, so I've tried to pretend that I don't. Recently, being out of work for so long and the frustration that has come along with, has triggered a LOT of old memories and feelings of utter futility. I'm torn between distancing myself from my parents for a while until I'm off this downward spiral, and writing a letter telling them just how much harm has been done, just to get it out there. I know what you mean about resenting having to be nice to the abuser, I'm starting to get that now. I'm only just beginning to feel like things that were said and done to me over the years have had an effect on where I am now.

Kaz, I'm really glad that you're still hanging on, continuing to heal. I also really appreciate having the opportunity to talk with you about things. Each time I do, I come away feeling less alone. I hope I can do the same for you, in some way.

Sorry about my excessive verbosity once again. It's feast or famine with me, either complete reticence or an epic oration.

Pschocandy, a lot of what you say resonates with me. You said you don't want anything wrong with you, so you pretend to be better. Things is, what exactly is wrong? How do we tackle it, what is the cure? I have sometimes thought that the only thing would be to have the memories excised from my brain, I would have that operation if I could.

I hate that dad is really sweet and caring sometimes, he says he doesn't remember anything at all. They have agreed that in my mind it did, so that is progress. Another thing is that I want special treatment, I want them to feel lucky and honoured whenever I agree to see or talk to them, I know that is wrong but I still feel it.

I have also begun to realise recently the extent of the abuse, not just sexual. Being kept up till 3am whilst at college, being asked why do you misbehave so? Then you cry with tiredness and frustration and get bollocks for crying crocodile tears. There is no way of winning. They dominated me entirely, choosing my degree and career etc. I now don't work, as I don't even know what I want to do, having always been pushed into my parents ideas. I am trying to brake free of them and keep some stuff for me, I changed my name by deed poll, it hasn't really helped and now that I am back in contact with them I feel guilty for doing it!

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggg!

Its such a mess, I am 31 and still feel like I don't have my own life, like a child who doesn't know where her place in the world is.

You said your husband died, that is too much on top of what already happened to you. I was so sorry to read that. Are you with someone now?

I am lucky, I have found someone who lets me be, if I need to cry or talk for hours, he is always there. I have come so far with his help, I feel lucky to have him.

Don't worry about saying too much or too little, its good to read whatever you can type. I am so glad that it helps you to talk about this stuff, keep talking then!

Sorry, when I type fast I often miss out letters - Psychocandy!!

I'm in the same predicament, not having any real direction in life, not knowing what to do with myself at times. Even though I've been on my own for 15 years now, I still have a hard time making decisions for myself without first seeking the approval of others.

I've been dominated and intimidated so much, that whenever I do decide on a course of action, I'm easily swayed by the disapproval of others. But now I'm trying to put my foot down, and as far as work and stuff goes, I'm going to do what fulfills *my* needs, and what will make *me* happy, and if other people don't approve, that's tough. Mostly, I'm just mucking along and going with the flow, which isn't all that bad, actually.

Losing my husband was hard, yes. We were in a car wreck. It's still terribly difficult to speak of, because I was there and I couldn't do anything about it.

No, I'm not with anyone right now. It's been a really long time. There was someone a while back who I'd started something with, but he had far too serious a drinking problem and an uncontrollable temper, and was dragging me down so badly, I had to walk away. I'm not averse to the idea of being with someone again, it's just that given a choice between being with someone for the wrong reasons and being alone for the right ones, I'd rather be right.

I'm glad you've got someone who's so caring and supportive. I know a couple guys like that, friends of mine. Who knows what the future will hold... maybe I'll win one of them over!

Oh, and no need to apologise for typos to me, I'm the worst typist ever!

Hello Kaz and Psychocandy! My name is Willem and I'm a 31-year-old guy who lives in South Africa. I have a heck of a lot of 'stuff' but child abuse is among them. In my country in the time when I was young child abuse was the norm and accepted and expected. Sexual abuse of children happened regularly and for instance in schools, by teachers. Children were expected to respect and obey adults and so the children who were sexually abused just submitted to it and never spoke about it. I was lucky enough not to be sexually abused myself but somebody who I'm dependent on was not so lucky and got abused and not only that, but suffered several other kinds of traumas as well as a child, and this person has had a sort of 'bruised and broken' spirit as a result, and because of my dependence on and identification with this person much of it got transferred onto me.

While I was not sexually abused, I was physically and psychologically abused. Physical abuse ... there was a lot of it, because like I said in the old days children were beaten in schools. I got beaten a lot considering that I was a 'model student'. I was quiet and unobtrusive, rather attentive and enthusiastic about learning, and I worked hard and got excellent grades. In school I was most of the time among the top achievers. Nevertheless I got beaten and sometimes quite badly, to the point of bleeding. Teachers could beat kids at their own discretion. I usually got beat for forgetting some piece of equipment like an eraser, or my gym clothes. I got beat a few times because of something wrong that somebody else did. Some of the teachers had the policy of punishing the entire class if only one kid did something wrong, on the principle that that would make the kid who did the wrong thing extremely unpopular among the other kids. It did not work that way for me, though ... it made instead the *teacher* very unpopular with me.

Then there was the military training and the military-style abuse.

And then there was the pervasive psychological abuse that was imposed on *everybody* in the society on different fronts, such as in the schools, in the churches, and from the politicians.

And then there were all kinds of traumas I suffered as a result of personal ideosyncrasies that just didn't fit in with other people's plans.

My 'stuff' is rather different, I guess, than the 'stuff' of other people here, because it was an entirely different sort of world I grew up in, and that world is now gone, but I'm still here, and I also now don't know what to do with myself. I, too, am 31 and directionless in life.

Well, at 31, in a lot of ways, you guys are way ahead of me. I’m 54. My memories were so repressed that I’m just now being to realize them. I really thought I did have an idyllic childhood.

Wish my mom were still alive so I could confront her. While we were growing up, Dad worked 12 hours a day, so obviously he wasn’t around much. Tried to run some thoughts by him the other day, but he was oblivious to what was going on at home during that time period. I’m up to remembering I was in some sort of counseling but I can’t remember how old I was or why I was there.

Always thought I loved mom better. Now I’m beginning to wonder whether it was love or fear. Isn’t it classic to love your abuser and try to have them find favor with you. They’re not going to…but you keep on trying any ways.

In my own case, I have a sort of a problem ... I feel abused, but there is no 'abusers' in the form of individual human beings that I can identify. I feel exploited, manipulated, lied to, taken advantage of, betrayed ... but who were the people who did it? Politicians ... religious leaders ... teachers ... not people who were ever very close to me, but their ideas and decisions had a very great influence over me. Where are they now? Haven't they all suffered greatly after Apartheid ended? Aren't they all traumatised now, as well? I think it's a traumatic thing when a person's whole world collapses. The people who *identified* with Apartheid and the ideas and ideals behind it must all, now, be suffering from some sort of shock and post-traumatic stress ... can we say that 'Apartheid' is the abuser? Is it right that I, a white person, who's supposedly been privileged by this system, now say I've been a victim of it? It feels like a cop-out ... it feels just wrong to blame the 'system'. Who was responsible for the 'system'? Wasn't it politicians, and weren't those politicians in power because ordinary good honest white folks voted them into power? Weren't it the ordinary good honest white folks who believed them and carried out their commands? So were the ordinary good honest white folks to blame and was I to blame as well, sharing in this collective blame because I was supposedly an ordinary good honest white person? Isn't it right and proper that we should now be punished for the sins of our fathers?
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I don't know how to face the horror of what happened and of what is still happening ... how is it possible that supposedly ordinary good honest people could *do such things* to each other ... or are people in general evil by nature? When and where is it all going to end?
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In my own case I keep going on because I irrationally ... in other words, contrary to the evidence ... believe things are going to turn out fine. But are they? Anyways for me it takes an almost superhuman effort to keep going with living and trying things to make my life and the lives of others mean something and become better and hoping that someday the nightmare might end and we could wake up and discover that things have really been OK all along. Or just find out that things have not been OK, but they're OK now.
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I just have this weird vision, this weird idea in my head. This idea is of human beings actually existing in peace with each other ... in a situation where they 'live and let live', where they don't threaten each others lives and values, where they don't try to destroy themselves or each other. I have this weird notion that people just might find that it's quite nice to be able to speak to each other and listen to each other and learn from each other, not trying to force their ideas on each other with psychological or physical force. Just imagine if everybody in the world could have this sort of relationship with each other, just to be kindly disposed towards each other ... seeing another human being as someone you could invite into your house, attend to his or her comforts, give him or her something to eat and something to drink, and then relax and chat about interesting things.
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I have this weird idea in my head, that maybe parents could really 'raise' their kids well. That parents could, somehow, realise the incredible wrongness of abusing their children in various ways. For the life of me I can't figure out what parents 'get out of' abusing their kids. It doesn't make their own lives any better, it just wrecks their kids' lives. Parents should be aware of what constitutes 'abuse'. It's not so hard to figure out that it's not OK to use your own child, or anybody else's child, as an object to gratify your sexual lusts and desires. It's not so hard to figure out that it's not OK to beat your child, or anybody else's child, causing them physical pain and also fear and humilitation. It's not so hard to figure out that it's not OK to insult your child, or anybody else's child, or to play destructive psychological games with them, exploiting their trust in you, their dependence on you, manipulating their hopes and fears and feelings, threatening their sense of security, warping them with demands and reproaches, making them feel unloved and helpless, controlling or dominating their lives, or totally rejecting them, or any of the other ways in which parents hurt and harm their children ...
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Why can't people figure all of that out? It just keeps on happening ... people just keep on doing the same things to each other. I have a friend whose father sexually abused him and in other ways too. He's now also suffering from paranoid schizophrenia ... he's in and out of psychiatric institutions ... he's been in and out of many different jobs ... and he can't take care of himself *and he's still dependent on his father and he's torn between love and hate of his father*. I have another friend and her parents supposedly love her but they exploit her to the point where she has no life of her own. She's now expecting her second child but it seems she's not going to have any time for this child just like she's not had any time for her first child. She's due any day now but she's still continuing with her work, seeking new projects, attending meetings, because her parents are financially totally dependent on her. They make terrible misuse of her ... they just flat-out demand that she sets everything else aside and help them out ... they even say she has to choose between her parents, and her family - her husband and children ... and obviously they mean that she should choose them, not her family. And as for herself? Her own self doesn't even come into the picture.
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And so it goes on. And what about the entire country? South Africa is still a mess!! My own people ... the Afrikaners ... have been absolutely devastated. The prosperous ones have left the country ... they are now in Britain, in Australia, in New Zealand, in America, and elsewhere ... and their children and grandchildren will no longer see themselves as 'Afrikaners', will no longer speak the language, will no longer even remember Africa ... and the ones left here? So many have lost their jobs ... are now destitute, many of them alcoholics ... among the young people many are drug addicts or turn to crime ... organized crime is rampant ... many people are heading towards 'running on empty' ... the money they have left over from the 'bad old days' is running out and no more is forthcoming, there's no hope of getting new jobs, but they're still trying to hold on to the old 'way of life' but what's going to happen when everything is gone?
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And here the old attitudes continue ... racism, certainly ... as a woman I know well said: 'I'm a racist, because racism means thinking that 'we' are better than 'they' ... and I do believe that, I do believe that 'we' are better people than they are, but I think we are obliged to take care of them'. Racism is believing your own people are better than others, and know better than others, and are therefore in a position to make their important decisions for them... but that's wrong! Nobody is in a position to make the important decisions for other people. There has to be an attitude of *trust* and *respect as equals* between people, or the relationship is doomed from the outset.
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But how do you trust people who seem to demonstrate their untrustworthiness over and over again? How do black people trust white people after their trust has been abused, broken and betrayed so many times? And how do white people trust black people, since we know that they justifiably distrust us and have every reason to hate us?
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So there is still massive distrust between people here. There is currently a program of 'black empowerment' going on, by which white people are done out of their jobs and replaced by black people. But this process is unfortunately wasteful and destructive. Black empowerment is necessary, it is totally necessary that the inequalities be rectified ... but so much bad stuff happens in the process. So many black people have been put into jobs for which they are not qualified, having lacked the necessary education. So many very capable white people have lost their jobs, and the country has lost their expertise. There are not many jobs where a black person is in the position and receives the money, but a white person has to do his or her actual work but doesn't get the money or the credit for it. And as a result of this process, firstly like I said many capable white people are out of work, but also, because of incompetence, many insitutions have been wrecked and many jobs have been *lost*. There is also now in the existing institutions a great amount of incompetence and consequently a great degree of corruption.
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The whole process goes hand in hand with what we have come to call 'messing with people' which means, first of all, rampantly exploiting them ... making misuse of them, letting them work themselves to death without proper pay or recognition ... also, taking them totally for granted, as in, they have no choice, they simply have to do exactly what you want them to, and what's more they should be obliged to you for it ... also, messing them around, for instance what happened to a friend, his employers and his wife's had absolutely no regard for the fact that they were newlyweds, but they were placed into positions where they had to work over a thousand miles away from each other ... or they let a person come at great expense from Eastern Europe with lots of promises, then when that person has come tell him he's no longer needed, and he's not afforded what he needs to return to his home ... in other words they 'mess' with people, they subject them to decisions that totally shape and change their lives, but those decisions are arbitrary and have absolutely no regard for their wellbeings ... also, terminating their employment without a good reason, and trying to cheat them out of pay and pension owed to them ... also, telling people they should 'work off their guilt', in other words, exploiting their feelings of guilt ... deliberately making them feel inferior ... being totally callous towards them and having no sympathy for their problems. This form of 'messing with people' is a new form of large-scale, widespread, institutional abuse of people. It happens all over the country. Typical for instance is when my father was held up in his office by two men armed with guns. The 'authorities' of the university who were responsible for safety did nothing. Nobody from the top university officials even came to express sypmpathy towards my father. Only a few of his colleagues did. A while later my father and mother were both dismissed from their jobs and the university tried to cheat them out of the money owed to them by contract should they be dismissed.
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All of this isn't really 'child abuse' ... but it's a similar thing, it's abuese of 'inferiors' by 'superiors' ... it's abuse of people by the authorities that are above them that have the power to influence and control their lives, that are supposed to 'take care of' them but grossly neglect or miscarry this duty.
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It is not a black-on-white form of abuse ... it extends to everybody in the country. The ordinary, poor, 'lowly' black people have always been exploited and abused and they're still exploited and abused though the abusers now have the same coloured faces as they. The actors have changed, but not the roles. Only a small minority of black people have gained power and advantage ... the majority of black people are still poor and powerless, and many of the new advantaged black people have so far not shown sympathy or initiative to improve the circumstances of the others. Many black people are disillusioned about the new form of government as they see their grievances are not heard. In addition to the inequality and misery that continues unabated, there is now the scurge of AIDS which appears to be set to turn the country into a wasteland. Among the poor black people, AIDS is rampant, and also alcoholism and abuse of other drugs, and also lots of crime and violence. My sister who's a medical doctor for instance tells how the people get drunk each weekend and then start taking their aggression out on each other with any object that is handy ... bricks, hammers, screwdrivers ... she tells of one guy who in his random anger took a machete and rearranged his girlfriend's face with it ... he cut her up so badly she was hardly recognisably human ... she survived but the nerves of her face are severed in such a way that she can now never smile again ... not that she has much to smile about. But anyways, there is clearly a very large amount of frustration and anger and fear in the country, among black and also among white. And still the abuse rains down from on high onto the heads of those down below, and ultimately it affects those who are most vulnerable, those with the least power ... the young children. We know that many are starving ... many are sexually abused and exploited by their parents ... even to the point where parents 'sell' the sexual favours of their children ... many children are physically abused, and many are plain neglected, their parents not doing anything for them, or being dead, and the children having no-one else to take care of them ...
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And so it goes on.
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But I just have this weird idea in my head that it *shouldn't be this way*!! There's nothing OK about people abusing each other. There's nothing OK about parents abusing their children. People who have been subjected to such abuse should be able to justifiably feel that they have been terribly wronged ... they should be able to justifiably feel that they have suffered under injustice ... they should be able to be justifiably angry about what happened, angry with their abusers because *it just is not on* ... it doesn't help anybody! People should be able to mourn for the lost days of their childhood ... mourn for the loss of the OK and unscarred and happy child that they could have been but were not as a result of the abuse. We must try and move beyond the abuse, build new lives, and new happy memories, for ourselves, but I think it's also necessary that we take time to acknowledge the abuse and the wrongness and what was lost, and mourn for ourselves also...

Hi Psychocandy, how are you getting on?

I mentioned in another thread that it was time for me to move on and leave the past in the past. I realised with all my anger and stuff I was miserable, whereas if I tried to let go of it, I ws happy. So its time to let go, its scary, as I will be letting go of part of myself, who will I be afterwards? Happier I hope. Its working for now, as to whether I can keep it going, we shall see.

Have you ever thought let that? If so did it work at all for you?

Hi willem, I am very sorry for your troubles, you have much to deal with on many levels. At the moment I cannot really think of anything helpful to say to you, your stuff is too big for me. But good luck with all of it.

Thanks Kaz and don't worry on my account, I'm dealing with my problems so far.

Hi, Kaz and Willem! How have you been? I've been holding up all right,thanks!

While I can't really imagine what the things you've experienced must be like, Willem, I do share your views on the way people ought to treat each other. I can't begin to understand why people need to hate or be cruel to one another, especially people they're supposed to love, or ones they've never even met, for pity's sake! What pleasure can possibly be gotten out of hurting someone smaller or weaker than yourself? I, personally, can't bear the thought of hurting someone else. I have serious problems trusting people in general, but I certainly don't judge their worth as people based on nationality, race, etc. I try to base my opinions of people on individual merit (or lack thereof). A little understanding and compassion goes a very long way, don't you think?

I've been doing my best to let go of the past as well. Anger and fear are heavy burdens to carry. Day-to-day living, and things in the present which I *can* do something about, take up enough energy without running myself down over things I *can't* change.

Unfortunately, while I forgave my parents a long time ago, I still haven't forgiven myself- if that makes any sense. What I need to do now is work at silencing the inner voice which tells me I'm worthless and doomed to failure, and break the psychological hold they still have over me. The only person whose approval I need is mine.

Hi Psychocandy and I'm happy to hear you're still here and doing fairly well too.

I think I want to say this ... though the forms of abuse that people suffer under are different, there is generally this legacy of the abuse that is the same among us all ... that, as a result of it, we feel unloved and unloveable ... worthless, helpless and powerless ... very uncertain and with little hope for the future ... and somewhat shattered inside, with some of the abuse 'internalised' with which we keep punishing ourselves, and we feel divided up, broken inside ... to a greater extent or to a lesser ... and from this we need to recover, to become whole people again and to start living for ourselves and believing we are worth something, worth loving.

A totally random thought and completely off the topic. Here it is a major Christian holiday, which from my limited experience not being Christian, is celebrated by being with family. Yet this board has been busier today than any single other time. I wonder why that is?

Perhaps we're being extended family to each other because we care?

Not being Christian, either, I don't usually do much for this holiday ... but I must say that being here with all of you is the first time in a long time I've felt like I even have a 'family' at all.

I'm also not a Christian ... mainly I am on here on Sundays because then it is fairly quiet and my internet access is not too bad ... though today it's not as good as it usually is ...