A Conversation for On Medieval Heresy

Writing Workshop: A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 1

a girl called Ben

Entry: On Medieval Heresy - A915293
Author: Montana Redhead (heretics and inquisitors welcome) - U155915

Hi

This is Montana Redhead's entry on Heresy, which I hope to include in the Uni Project on Belief. A853751.

I will be submitting the entries for the project to the Editors at the end of January, so any comments need to be made relatively swiftly.

Ben


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 2

a girl called Ben

Jimster has cast his eye over the project as a whole and made some comments on individual entries here: F51226?thread=238444&latest=1

It is exciting to see such a postitive response from the Italics to this!

B
*spamming WW for the sake of speed*


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 3

a girl called Ben

MR - this is good, as Toxxin has already noted. GTB will turn it into GML for you, so don't worry about that.

The only thing that the Editors are likely to ask for is some headers and sub-headers. Do you want to put them in yourself, (which might be best) or leave it to GTB?

Once again - many thanks.

B


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 4

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

Sorry, ben, stuff keeps getting lost here and there. Subheaders? It's an essay. Essays don't have subheaders. But I'll see if I can make heads or tails of it.


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 5

toxxin - ¬°umop apisdn w,I 'aw dlaH

I kinda agree with you MR; not that there's anything wrong with subheads in a long essay. This one is brief though, so I'd only inlude a couple at most and then only if they really elucidate the structure of the piece. I guess it's as well to remember that some readers can only cope with small sections of text. Perhaps you could add some big, gaudy pictures. smiley - smiley


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 6

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

Sorry, I'm used to grad school, where anything short is sort of...well. passe.


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 7

a girl called Ben

Sure. I dislike subheaders in anything which is printed, because I can read the whole thing. However the the Edited Guidelines suggest them, I think rightly, because the entries here are intended to be read on the screen, not on the printed page.

If your heart quails you, leave it. GTBacchus can put them in when he subs.

Thanks again for your entry. It is good.

Toxxin - can't we persuade you to put some of your opinions to pixel?

B


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 8

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

It's all good, Ben. I've just been drilled on my lack of connections lately, so feeling a bit touchy on the subject. I didn't realize quite how long it was!


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 9

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

So, I went in and added a few subheaders. Hopefully that should help some.


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 10

a girl called Ben

That looks great, Montana Redhead. Much appreciated.

B


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 11

Trout Montague

Hello.

Near the beginning "... the church ...". Yes, but which church. This implies that there is only one.

Otherwise, you may find that you can link to this A944453.

DMT


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 12

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

May I point out that the last Cathar was burned at the stake in 1321? Ergo, Bosch could not have been a Cathar. There were many dualists heresies. The Cathars were among the most viciously repressed. Given his place of birth, etc, it is entirely possible that he was part of the Unitas Fratrum, or even an offshoot of the Waldensians or (less likely) the Bogomils.

Just thought you should know. For backup, please consult Wakefield, Lambert, Given, and others. Although Wakefield and Lambert are the best large-scope works on the subject of medieval heresy.



A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 13

Trout Montague

"May I point out that the last Cathar was burned at the stake in 1321?"

Yes you may. But is it correct? Just because the last known execution took place in 1321 doesn't necessarily mean that they were wiped out does it?

So Bosch could have been a secret Cathar.

DMT


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 14

a girl called Ben

*galumphing in where fear to tread*

I remember reading that there is a theory that the Plantagenet Kings were practitioners of the Old Religion (ie Wicca) into the 14th and even the 15th centuries. The argument was (a) circumstantial and (b) making some specific point which I now forget, but I do see Dr T's point that the last execution is not necesarily a guide to the last practitioners.

B


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 15

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

Certainly, Dr. T, you may have a point. However, according to folks who have worked on this topic far longer than I have, the Cathars as Cathars were done in 1321. Now, did their dualist views continue onward? Quite possibly. However, practioners of such dualisms did not call themselves, nor were they called, Cathars.

And while I'm certainly open to following how Dr. T arrived at this conclusion, that Cathars existed into the 15th century, I would like to know the source of such an assertion, since that could change the face of Cathar scholarship as we know it. Which would make most of the professors I work with mighty suprised.


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 16

a girl called Ben

Nothing like surprising professors! I only wish I knew how. But I take your point that it has to be done with accurate source material.

smiley - runing off, angels fearing to tread, and all that.

B


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 17

Trout Montague

"The Secret Heresy of Hieronymus Bosch" by Lynda Harris ... seems to have got a slating by the critics but there you go.

DMT


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 18

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

The problem with Harris, as I recall, is that she accepts a very old notion of how Cathars came to be. The theory, now discounted, went something like this: the Manichees were persecuted in Africa, moved into the Balkans and Eastern Europe and became the Bogomils, and then the Bogomils moved into Italy (the Waldensians) and France (the Cathars). This theory has since been disproven.

Dualist heresies have been around a very long time, and while there are similarities between them (hence the term dualists), the differences are vast. Also, if Bosch had been a Cathar, he would have NOT PAINTED since painting, as an expression of the ways in which the Light was trapped, would have been a bad thing to do. Not to mention that the Cathars were extremely passive, and Bosch's work is anything but. While I respect Harris' knowledge of Bosch's work as an art form, I question her knowledge of the historicity of heretical movements of the middle ages and early modern periods. I still say it would be much more likely that he was involved with the Unitas Fratrum.


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 19

Trout Montague

Poetic licence then ...

Heronymous Bosch - Catholic or Unitas Fratrum

... oh dear.


A915293 - On Medieval Heresy

Post 20

Montana Redhead (now with letters)

hey, Ben, how goes the University project?


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