A Conversation for A Brief History of Greece

Macedonia

Post 1

Alfredo

It's sad that Greece is so hyper-sensitive what Macedonia is concerned.

Almost trigger happy.


And the power of the Greeck Orthodox church is the same as the Russia is and that's almost a theocratic church/society policy.


For the rest; Greece is wonderful !


Greetings from Amsterdam


Macedonia

Post 2

Gnomon - time to move on

Hi Alfredo! Yes, the Greeks are very sensitive about areas that they consider once "belonged" to Greece. If you ask a Greek to settle a border dispute, he is quite likely to start quoting history from 1000 BC.


Macedonia

Post 3

Thalassinos

For the most part Greeks, in relation to the issue, are victims of a polarized education 'objectivizing' history and developing an illusion of owning it. Such education, I think, is popular in regions where frictions between states are not that old. The problem in this case is not so much related to the scientific historical interpretations on the issue. Most of the related international bibliography justify for the most part the strong link between Macedonia and the rest of Greece which made the former part of the then broadly defined notion of the latter, at least from 5th-4th century BC onwards. But this shouldn't be used as an argument of such an importance for current disputes anyway. Greeks' problem is that they shouldn't have elevated such a trivial name-dispute to such a crucial matter, dominating a big part of their foreign policy.Why to challenge in such a fierce way an -unfounded and self-evidently inaccurate anyway- historical argument linking a Slavic-Albanian populated region with ancient Macedonia. They could be called 'France' of 'England' if they opted to name their country like this. It's their problem anyway... It does not make sense to own in any exclusive way culture, history or names. Implying territorial claims is however a whole different issue. In Greece (if this trend exists at all) it comes, for the most part and solely, from a small marginal extremist right wing party with 3,5% of the votes. In the new formed Macedonia-State though it is an institutionalized part of the national ideology implying or stating directly territorial claims against the Greek region of Macedonia as well as against the Bulgarian equivalent one. As it is widely known the geographical area called Macedonia is divided between the three countries (roughly speaking, around 52% is currently part of the Greek state, around 43% is part of the newly born state and around 5% is part of Bulgaria). In any case, someone would understand easier the overwhelming preoccupation with similar issues from the part of newly formed, unstable and insecure countries (Macedonia was in the verge of a civil war few years ago with a dispute between its Slavic and Albanian populations) than from Greece's part. Thank you very much. smiley - smiley


Macedonia

Post 4

sirXixo

First of all! It is not areas that are once belong to greece! Nobody in greece cares about the part that was and is outside of the Greek borders! But you need to understand these: For thousand of years Greece and Greeks have tries to sustain the macedonian name! In all the ancient writings it sais "Alexander the Great, King of Greece", no king of serbia, albania or any other country. For the last 500 years all the balkans tried to invate and conquere Greece! So now that 10,000 of them decided to guther and make a new country, they can't start calling it Macedonia can they?And furthermore, the problem of the Greeks is not that they are going to call it Macedonia! The problem is that now they are making maps that diaply half of greece as territory of "New Macedonia"! How would you like to open the AZ of France and see London in it?


Macedonia

Post 5

Gnomon - time to move on

The original Macedon was a big country which included part of what is now Greece and also all of the country which now calls itself Macedonia. Why do Greek people object to that country calling itself Macedonia, since that is what it is and always was, before Alexander ever conquered Greece.


Macedonia

Post 6

Gnomon - time to move on

Actually, Alexander the Great was never called King of Greece, as the name Greece was only invented later.


Macedonia

Post 7

sirXixo

Wait! Greece was always been called greece (since the golden age of athens)! Alexander was the first to unite greece! Under one kingdom!
And that place was called macedonia before Alexander, his father phillip was the King of Macedonia!

And if its ok! For everyone to use that name! Then also the indians (ASIA) should called them selves Macedonias!

And the Greeks don't have a problem why the called the name macedonia! The problem is why on the serbian maps there is a lot of display of greek territory!


Macedonia

Post 8

sirXixo


Macedonia

Post 9

Gnomon - time to move on

You are showing your limited grasp of Greek history.

The land called Hellas during the "Golden Age of Athens" encompassed all of modern Greece except for the modern Greek region called Macedonia.

Hellas was not a united country, it was a collection of small city-states.

The country of Macedon was north of Hellas and included two regions: (1) what is now the country of Macedonia and (2) the modern Greek region of Macedonia. Macedon was not considered to be part of Hellas by the Athenians, although the people spoke Greek.

Philip of Macedon conquered Hellas and Alexander finished the job, setting up the Hellenic Empire. After Alexander's death, this fell apart and Hellas went back to being a collection of city states until it was conquered by the Romans. The name Greece was a Roman name for the land.

Hellas was invaded in the 5th Century AD by Slavs who changed to speaking Greek. Most of the modern Greeks are a racial mix of these Slavs and the ancient Hellenes.

Since ancient Macedon was split into two, one part being in Yugoslavia and one in Greece, each area has a valid claim to call their region Macedonia. The former Yugoslavian Macedonia was part of Macedon, but was never part of Greece, so there is no reason why it should change its name.


Macedonia

Post 10

sirXixo

First of all ! Its nice to copy and paste from other websites! Second I am greek! So it will take you a while to catch up with my knowledge for greek history! Third you don't get it! Greece means HEllas! SO before you copy and paste please try to understands what you are reading!

Hellas is how Greece is being pronounce in Greek! For example they don't say Greek they say Hellenic!

Greece was alwayys greece! When xerxis cam to conquere all the Greeks gathered not only athnes!!

GO and copy and paste that also!


Macedonia

Post 11

sirXixo

What I don't get is what is your problem with Greece?


Macedonia

Post 12

Gnomon - time to move on

I haven't copied and pasted anything.

The ancient land of Hellas and the modern state of Hellas / Greece are very little to do with each other, since modern Greece is a country and ancient Hellas wasn't. Modern Greece has no claim on the "Serbian" Macedonia, because there are no Greek speaking people living there, but that country is part of what was the country of Macedon 2,300 years ago (which was never part of Hellas).

Anyway, it's nice to try and educate you, but I have to go now.


Macedonia

Post 13

sirXixo

You don't get it! Hellas means greece in Greek!

The macedonian Empire was a vast amount of land it wasn't only the serbian territory!

Alll the buildings, the Kingdom of pella and everything else originally from macedonia was found in Thessaloniky!
Everything else that was build in when the empire started is all over the place from serbia to india! But you can't say that all asia is macedonian! CAn you now?

Man/or woman! Listen they don't actually care if they will called macedonian or ethiopians! You know that! They are just trying to find an excuse in order to earn thinks! After the name will come the territory, after the territory will ask for more!

What where they doing the last 2,300 years. They just remembered that they are Macedonians?
Please! Some respect!

And yes you copy paste! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonia_(terminology)!


Macedonia

Post 14

Gnomon - time to move on

Since you are rude enough to not believe me when I tell you I didn't cut and paste, you are not going to believe anything else I tell you, so I'm not going to continue this discussion.



(That means I won't see any further posts you make here).


Macedonia

Post 15

sirXixo

That's your solution! My friend! I just gave the link from were you took everything! You do understand by leaving you just prove me right! The link is on the board if you press it you will notice that the exact paragraph is from wikipedia!

But again ou are not so bright! You should go and chase some green little fellow at the end of the rainbow! And leave reality to other people!


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Macedonia

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