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V-S talking about hyphenation

Post 1

van-smeiter

Hi FT,

I wrote what's below a few weeks ago but, when I went to post it in the PR thread, hootoo didn't work (for a couple of days) and then RL took hold, so I didn't get round to responding. I hope you don't mind me replying directly but I'm not sure it is petinent to the PR thread and, as you said, it was more about parsing the subject. Here is what I wrote:

Good day FordsTowel.

Hyphenation is tricky and, as I said, somewhat arbitrary.

The black cab driver is, to my mind, a very good example of the ambiguity of some expression that hyphenation can clarify.

A dictionary will describe the noun "black cab" (nothing wrong with that) but that gives us little clue as to the noun's usage. I would prescribe black-cab as the noun. Your example is someway toward the conventional method of getting around the problem but it doesn't solve the problem. What if your "cab driver who was dark skinned" were driving a black cab? Would you write 'black black cab-driver' or 'black black cab's driver'? Both phrases seem to be either verging on the poetic or to be prosaic.

And don't forget the possession that 'black cab's driver' connotates. Consider a black cab's driver who parks his cab outside his house and goes inside to sleep, forgetting to put the handbrake on properly; the cab rolls back and traps a pedestrian under its wheels. A different black cab's driver is walking past and stops to free the pedestrian. The freed pedestrian thanks the black cab's driver for his help but curses the black cab's driver for his carelessness.

Hyphenation allows the pedestrian to thank the black-cab driver for his help but curse the black-cab's driver for his carelessness.

Also, consider the difference from what we've been talking about if we'd been talking about mini-cabs/mini cabs and/or mini-cab drivers/mini cab drivers (especially given that a mini-cab could be a Mini!smiley - erm)

On the subject of genre, I've never paid much attention to it; Agatha Christie wrote some beautiful romantic-fiction but her books will forever be categorised as crime-fiction (and, by some people, criminal fictionsmiley - winkeye.) Science fiction, science-fiction, scientific fiction; each term has grammatical connotations and I think it is worth trying to be consistent if a genre has been identified (I'd always taken science-fiction/sci-fi to be that, ie a genre.) I agree with you that the programmes you mention could (and perhaps should) be classed as sci-fi (as could some episodes of The Avengers) so perhaps I was too quick to praise the distinction mentioned above. A distinction between sci-fi and fantasy could be a good thing but that would still be about genre.

Genre, what's the point?

Van smiley - cheers

Reading that back just now makes mostly sense to me but apologies if any thread references have been lost out of context. I didn't want to change what I'd written because I would've felt dishonest; I wrote a reply to a thread but I couldn't post it at the time.

Sorry if I've blathered or bothered you and I won't be offended if you don't reply to me.

Best wishes, Van smiley - cheers


V-S talking about hyphenation

Post 2

FordsTowel

Absolutely no worries, VS!smiley - ok

I never feel bothered by polite conversation and debate. I had begun to wonder why it just seemed to stop. (it seemed just to stop?)

Fortunately, the English language is fairly elastic. There is almost always one particularly proper way to say what we mean, but there are always alternates that work just as well. Much of communication is based on context, after all.

There are times when uncut and unabridged mean the same thing; but, even in the context of book collectors, uncut carries a particular meaning (the book, while already bound, has not first had its pages trimmed, creating outside edges that allow one to see pages 11 and 14, but not 12 and 13.)

I use hyphens to form compound words, certainly, and to break apart a prefix from a word when - without the hyphen - it would form a different recognised word.

I even use it occasionally to clarify the modifier's purpose. A classic example is 'We need more-experienced staff'; a staff with more experience as opposed to more staff that is experienced. But, given time, I'd sooner recast the sentence (unless it's a quote).

Certainly an attorney who is a general is different than an attorney-general. So I do understand much of what you're saying.

Still, in the case of a black driver of a black cab, I'd probably recast the sentence to break it apart that way. Cab driver is broken, and does not require a hyphen, so I'm not sure I can see myself believing that the colour is the key factor.

Using hyphenations should make reading more clear, not less understandable and requiring a greater grasp of punctuation than necessary.

We can discuss hyphenation, along with all the other popular subjects, at the anarchists' convention!smiley - biggrin

smiley - cheers
smiley - towel


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V-S talking about hyphenation

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