A Conversation for GG: Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Peer Review: A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 1

Gnomon - time to move on

Entry: Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks - A699069
Author: Gnomon - U151503

Here's an entry about the ever popular choral work "Carmina Burana".


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 2

Post Team

Wonderful smiley - bigeyes

I can hear this ringing in my ears just reading your words. smiley - ok

shazz smiley - magic


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 3

John the gardener says, "Free Tibet!"

Bravissimo! Encore... Encore...!

JTG's Journal:

O Fortuna (Nov 10, 2001)
Went to see/hear/experience Carmina Burana at Toronto's Roy Thomson Hall on Tuesday night. Wow! What a feast of sight and sound! A vast choir and an orchestra with everything but the organ grinder's monkey seemed to occupy as much space as the audience. The choir, orchestra, and soloists seemed to revel in this 13th century musical tribute to sex, booze, and roast swan. "oh, oh, oh, totus floreo..."

Thanks for the reminder. smiley - ok

JTG



A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 4

Zarquon's Singing Fish!

Me too!

I'm going to put a word in for 'Dulcissime'smiley - star - not mentioned and one of the most beautiful parts in the piece.

smiley - fishsmiley - musicalnote


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 5

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

Great piece, great Entry.

I never quite worked out how many Wafnas there are supposed to be - usually one or more of the men sings at least one too many.

Ever heard the roasting swan done by a countertenor? I once heard James Bowman do it. Fantastic!

And when the angelic choirboys sing 'Iam amore virginale totus ardeo' (or whatever it is) - sure, 'tis a moment to treasure.


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 6

Zarquon's Singing Fish!

Yes, I used to sing with the Birmingham Choral Society (formed before Birmingham became a city) and we had a countertenor - stunning!

smiley - fishsmiley - musicalnote


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 7

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

Is that the one that is now the Birmingham City Choir? Just curious, you understand. Do they sometimes join the CBSC?


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 8

Zarquon's Singing Fish!

No, it's separate. I've not lived in Birmingham now for ove 10 years, so I've lost touch with it really. We did some good stuff though. African Sanctus was my favourite!

smiley - fishsmiley - musicalnote


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 9

Azara

Hi, Gnomon!

Great entry!

I found just one typo: 'monasterey' for 'monastery' in the background section.

smiley - cheers
Azara
smiley - rose


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 10

Gnomon - time to move on

Thanks, Azara! I've fixed that typo now.

Singing Fish, I'm not going to add "Dulcissime". It may be beautiful, but it's only 40 seconds long. There isn't space to mention every one of the 25 songs in the work.


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 11

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

While you are fixing typos, it should be 'Songs of Beuren' acc. to most sources. But congrats on getting 'Benediktbeuern' - most people think it's '-beuren'.

Of course it's now been shown that the MS didn't originate in Benediktbeuern but in Seckau. I mention that because Benedictines might be a bit upset.

Although your title mentions mediaeval monks you don't say anything about them except that the MS was reportedly found in a monastery (which in any case was not where it came from). It might be worth adding a note about the 'goliards' and explaining that they were disgraced vagabonds who were possibly defrocked monks, but not monks actually under vows or in Holy Orders. This is nothing to do with the music of course, but just in case there are religious sensitivities.


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 12

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

One other small point - people prob. won't have heard of Schmeller so perhaps a brief note about him?


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 13

Gnomon - time to move on

I'll have to do a bit more research on all that monky business! smiley - biggrin


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 14

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

Very well - I can suggest a couple of places to start from:
http://www.nmt.edu/~golias/goliard.html
http://www.auburn.edu/~downejm/sp/rabfw/carmina.htm


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 15

Gnomon - time to move on

I've rewritten the "Background" section so that it now explains about the Goliards.

Bueren in modern German is just another way of writing Büren. I assume they are the same word.


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 16

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

Great stuff.

And you're quite right, but it isn't either Bueren or Büren, it's Beuren, isn't it?


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 17

Gnomon - time to move on

Some web sites call it Songs of Bueren. Others call it songs of Beuren. I think on consideration I'll go along with Encyclopaedia Britannica, which says "Songs of Beuern".


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 18

Henry

Good stuff Gnomon - really well done. That's all I was going to say, but after having read the thread, I must say I came away with the impression that the Goliards were a religious order. It's really the mention of defrocking that did it - after all, how could they be stripped of authority by a body that didn't give it to them in the frist place?
That picky note aside, a brilliant entry.


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 19

Bels - an incurable optimist. A1050986

Good job it was Orff and not Händl, or we'd really be in trouble smiley - winkeye


A699069 - Carmina Burana - Drink, Sex and Mediaeval Monks

Post 20

Gnomon - time to move on

I think the Goliards were originally properly ordained priests and genuine monks. They broke away from the church but continued to ordain new priests into the group, so that by Church law they were genuine priests. THe CHurch tried to stop them saying mass, teaching and so on, and eventually took the step of 'defrocking', stripping them of their priestly status. But this step was after Carmina Burana was written.

I hope that this is clear in what I have written in the Entry.


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