h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

The British legion are using a quote from the bible to publicise this years remembrance, as I was passing a billboard it caught my eye, and caught me off guard; I was expecting blatant consumerism from billboards. The quote was this;

'Greater love hath no man than this, that a man may lay down his life for his friends'

This really seems to encapsulate what this is all about.

I am more or less a pacifist, I don't think war should be necessary (especially the current one - if you can call it a war). Although I do see sometimes there is no alternative.

One thing that does puzzle me is whether or not remembrance day includes the enemie's dead, or is it just our soldiers. If it is the latter, doesn't this undermine the humanitarian aims of the whole thing, and promote nationalistic flag waving?

Please don't misunderstand me, I have the greatest respect for remembrance of those who lost their lives in war, whichever side they were on.

D.

I've always treated it (in my own mind) as being for our dead; not because they're better, or because they fought on 'right' side, but because they're *ours*. So it's not incompatible to have a celebration of remembrance for one's own forces, and still remember the dead of others.

Konrad

For me it has always been a bit of a mix. Mostly it is about "our side" i.e. the people of the armed forces who died in action. But it is also, for me, for the guys on the other side and indeed for the poor civilians caught up in the middle. Maybe I am missing the point, though. I do have neighbours, friends and family members who are unable to extend it in this way because of what they and their loved ones passed through in WW2.

I guess it means something different to everone.

Personally today I was (as always) a bit uncomfortable with the militarist aspects - soldiers marching past to stirring martial music. A 'celebration' of remembrance as they called it. It seems to me it should be less about the military and more about the innocent people caught up in war, conscripts and civilians, and others who didn't want to fight but felt they had to.

I was also upset that the dead of the terroist attacks of September 11th were alluded to. Not, of course, that their deaths shouldn't be comemerated and mourned, but this is not what remembrance means to me.

The terrorist attacks were acts of murder, acts of crime not those of war. To call them acts of war almost gives them the justification that the Al-Queda claim. War was not declared - it was act of cowardice and murder, not an act of war.

Also to include those tragic events seems to have a political motive. There is rising opposition to the war in this country, which the politicians won't even admit, never mind represent (which is after all their job - to represent the views of the people). Anyone who raises the slightest question about civilian bombing, is howled down as being pro-terrorist and compared to those who appeased Hitler.

To include the reasons for this conflict in our Remembrance day, the way I see it, is a way of popularising the flight against Afganistan.

Why weren't the Afgan civilians we have killed included in the remembrance?

D.

I appologise if I have inadvertantly offended anyone. I know this is a subject that many people have strong opinions about.

I was also troubled by the prominent mention of the victims of September 11th. It's hard to criticise remembering the dead of any event, but it was completely inappropriate for poppy day, IMHO, and the cynics amongst us (including me) can see a transparent political motive at a service which should not be political.

The military aspects do not make me uncomfortable though. They've carried the largest proportion of the losses, so it is right that they have the lions share of the coverage. The civilian services are very well represented and of course we remember them just as much.

Talking to veterans of the wars, all of whom were conscripts, I get the impression that they are not upset by the military aspects of it, as although not volunteers, they feel just as integrated a part of the army as those who were career soldiers.

Personally I'd like to see more made of Holocaust day in this country, and feel that this would be a more appropriate time to remember the inocent victims of all wars - if poppy day is to remember those who died in service, whether civilian or military.

But, as you lead with D, it means something different to everyone.

Konrad

I think it should be a remembrance for those killed in war - civilian or military. I hate the term "glorious dead". Most of these men died horrible deaths at the whims of cynical cold-blooded military commanders, there was nothing "glorious" about it.