h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Note: this is hypothetical and not specifically related to any current issues.


Dunno about you, but I keep coming up against a bit a problem when discussing world events.
For example, the Country A invades Country B. People against it have a go at country A and the people thereof for doing it.
But, country A has a population of many millions. It is inevitable that amoungst those millions are a percentage who did not agree with what their country did.
Also, when it comes to international politics and war, the leaders of the country get a disproportionately high influence on what actions that country takes, simply due to their position of power.

So when a country takes an action, how much of that action is the responsibility of the people of the country, the leader of the country, allies and enemies of that country and so forth.

An example being American Independance. There is a school of thought that this issue came about because of the intractable line taken by the British King with regard to administering the colonies. yet there was a very vocal part of perliament that saw what was going to happen and advocated choosing a different route, one which would have been acceptable to the colonies.

So it would be wrong to say that the British had brought about the situations that led to this. Yet at the same time, it is perfectly correct to say that the nation to which those British people belong did help give rise to the situation.

So as a dissenter, if my country does X, am I to be considered legally, morally, socially, whatever complicit in that action because it is my country which did it?

If I am complicit, but dissenting, am I to be guilty of not doing enough to change my countries role in the events. And what if the head of my country ignores the populace and does what they want anyway?

What if my dissent is in the tiniest minority? I.e. I am the only person who disagrees with what my country is doing.

In such a situation, would I be in anyway correct to seek the removal of a political/governing system that does not fairly represent the nation and its people?

Or can I claim immunity from such accusations based on my disagreement with the powers that run my country?

Blimey - that's a good question....

*wanders off to think about it.*

Deep and yet profoundly shallow.

thanks for the useful answer there chips.
Profoundly shallow how?

Ooops, very sorry, I thought I was talking to Clive.

My mistake.

Ah, not at all, my mistake. Soz for the misunderstanding!

The comparison with the War of Independence is an interesting but not valid one. In the 1770s, a tiny minority of the British population would have known about what was going on in the colonies, far fewer would have understood the reasons why.

In this day and age, many more (but by know means all) know what their country is doing and why because of the mass media.

Now *I'm* going to go and have a think about the question too

Oh great.

So how am I deep yet profoundly shallow?

I was trying to think of the name of fellow who was imprisoned for not paying income tax as a protest aginst the mexican war.

Henry David Thoreau (it finally came to me.)
As one example of taking responsibility for the hostile actions of one's country.

sorry I so dissapointed you.

ok, shake hands and make up I did

Hmm, interesting that Clive, did you google Henry? Just wondering if it is worth a punt when I get home to find out more?

< --shake

I came across HDT in one of my philosophy classes at uni about the right to protest and the philosophy of law.

I did Google HDT but only to check the spelling plenty of hits though if you want to know more.

He's a big figure on the platform of civil disobedience, like Martin Luther King and Ghandi for that matter

I shall give it a go.

hopes you are still thinking as this example is more from the other end (ie right to protest) and not about responsibility for the action in the first place.

Although having said that, does the act of defiance/rebellion against what ones country has done in ones name mean that one is no longer responsable for those actions that the PTBs took in any way?

Hello you two.........I was only teasing you know

No offence meant

okay then.

I guess that there could be a feeling of responsibility if you knew what your country's leaders were planning, disagreed, & did nothing to stop them or express your opinion.
If you didn't vote for the party in charge, you've probably done all that is reasonable. Unless you felt so strongly that you wished to leave the country & renounce your citizenship?

How do you know it's not a comparable situation? That could be any hypothetical situation

I think the climate that the individual was in plays a huge part. How responsible a person is for an event depends on how much of a gap there was between what they could have done and what they did do.

If the person was in a prison cell because of previous dissentations then they probably couldn't have done anything, so its not their responability at all.

If the person voted the politicians who made the choice in then they have a *very* minute responsability (If at all). Their action made it slightly more likely to happen, but it's unlikely they could have predicted with any reliability the result of what happened.

If, however, this had happened before and the person hadn't protested and hadn't voted against the office that did it then they have some responability, they could have predicted it might happen again and they elected to let it because they saw benefit in letting it happen (maybe they liked the politicians other policies and decided the ends justified the means)

Nobodys perfect, you can't afford to do everything you possibly could about everything you care about. But you prioritise in some order and when the things you don't prioritise don't get done and you have to take some resonsability for that.

I don't feel in any way responsible for our latest war, but I didn't protest it in person, so the next ones, in some small way, my fault.

>>Unless you felt so strongly that you wished to leave the country & renounce your citizenship?<<

That's easier said than done, isn't it ? And btw, governments change every four years or so, so nobody can probably expect you to leave the country you're living in every four years ?

Yes, I didn't see that as a realistic solution, unless you like the politics of another country better. But as you say, governments change.

<>

Essentially, I'd say yes, you can - if you have registered your dissent strongly enough.