h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Dr. Elisabeth Kubler-Ross, the Swiss-born psychiatrist
whose study of the end stages of life humanized the treatment of the terminally ill and helped to inspire the hospice movement in this country, died of natural causes Tuesday in Scottsdale, Ariz. She was 78.

What wonderful things she did!

LA TImes article requires free registration
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-kubler-ross26aug26.story

Yes, I heard about that from my local paper...

thanks abbi for letting us know.

I had read some of her work many years ago.

RIP dear Elizabeth.

Also Ran1

I never knew that.

She was fantastic, who else actually listened to the dying before her, everyone else just wanted them to hurry up and free the bed.

I have a deep, deep fear of others dying, I cry about it everyday, but I found her book (the one everyone knows) gave me some comfort.

Bet she wasn't afraid to die though.

That is quite a testimony to her work Kaz

She took dying out of the sterile psychiatrist office book and into a rightful part of natural life. Complete with individual rights, feelings and goals to be observed. She did a lot by opening the door to talking about it with dignity!

I am thinking of training to be a pagan hospital visitor. Everyone who knows me, thinks I will be bad at this because I am very emotional. But surely it is better to have someone come to visit you, crying their eyes out, than no-one visiting you?

Why do people think we have to be so stoic with the sick and dying. Why can't we let the emotion flow anyway? That is how I think of Elizabeth, she would help even with tears running down her face, because to want to help is a better attitude than to not want to help?

My therapist cried and laughed and hugged me.
I doubt I would have trusted or respected her opinions and guidance as much at that time in my life if she had not. It is not typical and not advised but it worked for me.

If you wanted to do that I think you should.
Never underestimate the power of just being willing to be there for people.

In crisis times people they have counted on previously, abandon them or feel uncomfortable so a stranger with a warm hand and open heart can be very nice whether they cry or not, it can be a precious gift of your time and emotions.

I am absolutely terrified of death, the death of anyone i love, any individual, any animal....most of all myself. I absolutely can not face up to it, the major reason i can't sleep without a is because i get this evil thing of, just as i am falling asleep, i somehow fight against it & wake up in a panic, unable to breathe; "i am dying!" then of course, the legs start & it is totally impossible to relax, so i have to get up & start all over again.

I think one of the major reasons i have (paradoxically) tried suicide is so i have some control over something which will inevitably happen.

Maybe if you are exposed to many deaths of those close to you when too young to make any sense of it, this is inevitable? Dunno, but maybe it might be a good idea for me to read this stuff; but scared it might make it worse, i usually deal with it by repressing it.

(Anyway, i can't get it in English here, i have asked the library to order me English books before, no can do.)

She sounds like a wonderful person. RIP, i am sure she will.

zdt

Of course be prepared and open for the full range of human emotions

Abbi, Ihave never heard of a therapist being so open with their feelings, I don't reackon they ever would in the UK. That makes me feel better about hospital visiting whilst crying!

Terri, I share that feeling with you. I plan for how to suicide when and if Moonglum dies before me. Its a ridiculous way to live.

Hi Kaz.

Yes, totally ludicrous, to be obsessed with the end of it all making the actual reality of "here & now"

I understand the Moonglum fears, it is this sort of nightmare that stops me fully committing to anyone. But again, it's no way to live really, the fear of what "might" happen, prevents you from experioencing the joy of what "is" happening...or could, if you weren't so scared!

zdt

Its funny I thought I was the only person who felt like this.

My mum doesn't understand, she sees birthdays as 'another year under your belt, I see them as another year closer to death. I hate celebrating moonglums birthdays, I would rather cry all day.

You know I have often felt we don't get on, and yet here we are sharing such a similar fear.

I really hate it when you say "We don't get on"; i can't begin to try & explain, so i just back off; which probably makes you feel even more "we don't get on"!!!

We share many of the same fears & hopes, we both have some difficulty at times communicating.

I certainly don't dislike you, we certainly have friends in common, especially PC.

You & Moonglum went out of your way to try & help me with the latest computer crisis, for which i am incredibly grateful. The fact that i didn't end up using the system you had offered wasn't because i had rejected it, simply that i had obviously at the same time been trying to work out a way of sorting it "on the ground" in France, luckily this eventually worked, so is obviously an easier way, if something breaks down agin (which i am sure it will!) i can start screaming at the person who installed it!

Take care, as fellow pagans we certainly have that in common too; though i am definitely "hedge" variety! Bless etc.

zdt

Okay Terri, its just a feeling I have had about you, but if you distance yourself from people, then maybe I have been detecting that instead.

Sorry.

You are right, we are fellow pagans as well.

I got paranoid, I saw people who joined your eyes discussion and got answers and you put them on your friends list. I found myself ignored a lot in eyes, I always asked you about your life and you never answered me and I never got on your friends list.

I do suffer from paranoia though and its makes me demanding and needy.

We should talk more together, I'll try to relax and not read so much into things and we should take this from Abbis page. Although thank you Abbi for giving us an opportunity to sort this out!

I think everybody is different because I suffered terrible losses early and felt driven to look for positive possibilities in the experiences.

I have always looked forward to the experience of passing like all other curiosity but I'm in no hurry.

At one time I considered suicide and it did feel powerful.
Once I felt the power to choose I no longer wanted it.
Plus I would always have it as a possible "final choice".
The unknown consequences of suicide scare me more than life or death.

I would not neccesarily be opposed to shortening my life if pain and suffering were too much and it lasted too long. I do not plan on that being the case.

I have been around several kinds of passings and of different ages and circumstances, personal and professional settings. There are many wonderous things that have happen to give me a sense of awe in the course of mourning and the process of dying.

I found it comforting to know the human condition sees that it is done in much the same stages whether it appears to be the same or not.
All loss is a death so even the little deaths we suffer lead us down the same path with different intensity. Learning about accepting death helps us with the enevitable neccesary losses within all of our lives.

Oops sorry for interuption.

You are welcome to my space!
PLease yourselves ladies

Oh abbi, that somehow seems very Victorian!

I am sure us "ladies" will observe the social niceties, i have a wonderful image of us all dressed in crinolines & stuff, coming to call for tea & cucumber sandwiches, armed with calling cards; which i firmly believe should be re-introduced. What a civilised method, "Madam X is at home on xxx, between the hours of xxx, callers are welcome" jolly good, & or & provided by the hostess; everyone knows what to expect & has a lovely time, but for the rest of the time you can slob about with no fear of people "dropping in" while you are still in your dressing gown at 3pm!

Not going to get into the heavy stuff right now 'cos i am off to bed soon & don't want it preying on my mind.

Great to see you on Bird's eye Kaz, you are now on my frinds list, i honestly thought you were before, but i am sometimes reluctant to add people without asking them, it seems rather a cheek somehow!

zdt

<>

That's interesting, Terri & Yoda,... My brother died when I was 3 and a half, and I was not and am not, too afraid of death - and my parents died when I was 20 and 26. But (I think) things were different for my younger brother - he was born after the brother who died, but was only 12 and 18 when our parents died - he never spoke about his feelings about this - but then he died himself, in March this year. I think he may have felt about it quite differently from what I do.

Hi 12 and 18 are hard ages to have lost both
His being born into a family where one sibling has died must bring its own weight.

My heart goes out to you
How have you been doing Adelaide?
I would imagine it is a roller coaster ride for you.