h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I would like to congratulate the Editors on the new addition of Talk Forums on the front page - excellent idea!

And I would also like to ask if The Forum A1146917 could also be included there. It is quite a good alternative to Ask h2g2 as it tends to deal with more 'serious' issues and threads there don't necessarily begin with a question for the community. Rather an idea or concept is put forth for other researchers to debate.

Any chance?


azahar

That would be good.

I think the italics are hoping 'ask' will become respectable again and then the forum won't be needed anymore.

Well, I think there is room for both Kaz. As I say, Ask is for asking questions of the community. Often the Forum brings up issues to be discussed that don't have a specific question involved.


az

I'm of a split mind on the subject. The Forum does deal with solid issues and concerns of the day. It can always use open and clear minds. How-ever, brodcasting it on the Front Page might serve to lure in all the same folks that like to clutter the "Ask" threads.

Six of one, half a dozen of the other, so to speak.

I agree Az but can see Nicks point as well.

The current thinking is not to drive traffic to the Forum just at the moment. That's not to say we won't eventually do that, but the Forum is a pretty special place and we're not 100% certain that giving it bigger status wouldn't damage that - or provide trolls with a target.

That might sound like a fob-off, but it honestly isn't. We're really impressed with the Forum. We were overjoyed by the response to the Election discussion forum, which the Forum people populated and showed us how well it can work - and how receptive and skillful it can be towards people either unwilling or unable to play by the rules.

We want to make sure the Forum is sustained and looked after, but we don't want to make a snap decision on it and at the moment we're busy with other projects, some of which we're hoping to unveil after the Summer.

I see your point, Rev Nick, but I also doubt that anyone thinking of starting a thread asking about what someone's cat is eating at the moment would actually start this on The Forum after they've had a gander at the introduction page.

I think having a more public announcement for The Forum would actually help it remain fresh and challenging, as now it is often 'the usual suspects' who turn up there.

And changes to the Ask h2g2 page have already been made with some success.


az

I think Jimster made sense too, looks like patince will be required!

or even patience

My last -worth ... How many newbies actually READ the intro and guidelines of a discussion area? A quick perusal, or simply a guess at the purpose based on the naming of it. And away they go.

I like Jimster's idea for now. Especially with the "Who's On-Line" showing 400-500 folks at a time now, some patience until some newer dust settles.

hi Jimster,

Well, perhaps The Forum is seen as somehow 'overlapping' too much with Ask h2g2. Or perhaps it's because many of the topics raised there might be considered too controversial for the Front Page.

Whatever.

I only suggested it as a way of getting more people involved in that particular forum.

No pasa nada.


az

Most of those four or five hundred aren't on h2g2 though, they're on other DNA sites.


I'm in two minds too. I'd like to see it happen at some point. I haven't been on the Forum much lately. I started avoiding it when all the trolling was going on a month or so ago. I'd like to see some tighter protocol around dealing with trolls before the Forum gets any more traffic.

Also I think this conversation needs to happen on the Forum itself as well as here.


I have been thinking the absence of a certain researcher has calmed things down a bit over there.

Well just to add my here as well....

I do think the Forum should be promoted as the "Serious weighty Discussion hootoo place tm". However I accept that there are some issues that need to be addressed.

Namely what to do if flame wars are occuring? Being a guilty party in the DW fiasco, something I know put a lot of people of "The Forum" I recognise that we probably have to find a sensible method of dealing with that kind of thing first.

Also the problem with researchers like "Shifty". Basically he is a troll, He evidently thrives on just posting trolling material to annoy people. Most of his posts are not in isolation against the rules but the generality of his demeanor is.

I personally have yiksed tonnes of posts as well as emailing the eds direct about him. There needs to be some form of dealing with this sort of thing more efficiently.

I think that trolling and flaming issues are community issues, not specific to any one forum as they tend to happen anywhere, anytime . . .


az

I'm of two minds about this. On the one hand, I am a little cautious about 'opening' the Forum to the public, as the more serious and controversial issues discussed there open the threads up to trolls. We also run the risk of being swamped by less serious posters who don't get the idea of what the Forum is for.

On the other hand, I (as a regular poster to the Forum) don't want to be seen as elitist or anything like that. Just as with all the other discussion forums, the Forum should be one all hootooers can participate in.

<> (Rev. Nick)

Now I see what you're saying, Nick, but it seems to me that (and no offence meant) this sort of attitude comes across as somewhat condescending. Though I am also concerned about what will happen if the Forum is widely broadcast, as I said above, I don't want the Forum to be something for only a few select members of hootoo, just because we're scared of the 'riffraff' and the 'masses' that will invade should the Forum be more widely publicised.

So yes, no rush, Italics, but in the end if you make up your mind to put the Forum on the FP, I won't be stopping you.

Some good points being raised here. Just a few responses to some of them:

EMR mentions not wanting to come across as elitist. Now, we always point out that h2g2 is open to all, but I don't necessarily belive elitism is a bad thing. The Forum works on a certain degree of trust, and we all know that not everyone responds well to that kind of freedom. The Forum could be said to be an area where intelligence and a level of social skills are assumed unless someone shows themself to be unworthy of that assumption (and sadly, all online communities have a proportion of trolls and flamers, even if h2g2 suffers from this less than some others). As such, it's a little like an exclusive meeting point where it's open to all, but not visible to all. You have to know who to follow in order to get there, which might suggest that the most useful participants might attract like to like.

Only a theory of course. But so long as participation is open to all, and people exercise a little patience with those who don't 'get it', it should be fine.

There's also a degree of maturity to h2g2 that automatically raises the bar. By maturity I don't mean that we don't know how to play or be daft, but that on the whole the online experience level on h2g2 is much higher than many other forums. Many online places are a bit like a marketplace with everyone shouting over each other. h2g2 can be like that at times and it can be exciting. We might even say that Ask h2g2 serves that function. It's the level place where the h2g2 community talks to itself, but it's also a jump-off point for more specialised activities. It can lead off to discussions about the site itself, it can inspire gameplay, it can be a meeting point for people to catch up with each otehr (and then dive into MiscChat) or it can lead to some very vibrant, frantic debates, which might break off to The Forum in the same way the recent Doctor Who threads eventually got moved to the h2g2 Doctor Who Group.

You can see Ask h2g2 as the wider party, if you like. Then if there are conversations you feel might be beter served being hosted at the Forum, we can consider moving the conversation there.

As for moving The Forum to the Front Page, there's no limit on the amount of links we can put on there (aesthetics aside). We just choose five because it looks even. But you might want to weigh up the differences between being open and *visible* to all, as opposed to being able to be a little more selective who you invite over for deeper debate.

Great points Jimster.

One question we might like to ask is *why* we would want the Forum linked off the FP.

Is it a status thing (are we feeling left out after the other forums got listed)?

Is it because we want more traffic? Different kinds of researchers? If so, why?