h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I know I was a bit (very, too?) harsh in my post but I'm feeling fery grumpy today.

Perhaps I need to read the entry on post post remorse

Gno - it's been a while since I had time to really hang out in PR but it used to drive me nearly insane with the, "put a comma there" "no put the comma here" "that semicolon should be a colon" "you have a subheader where it should be a header" stuff

I have no objections to American vs. British English per se, but we have always been so vehemently British English that it seems weird to have this.

Someone mentioned up there that our books come from the states and aren't "translated". That's because we don't demand it and we can manage. But I have read American versions of Dick Francis books (a mistake I won't repeat) and I have an American version of a popular physics book (written by Brits) which have both been "translated" and it grates. Which is why I do appreciate and fully support the use of AE for American subjects.

As it happens, since I don't have that much time for h2g2 my opinion is neither here nor there but I do like to air it now and again.

Dr Z - one thing before the move that put me off joining in any discussions about the site, and later with the noesis thing was that it was too much and it seemed to be all over the place and I just couldn't keep up. Then there is the issue of Google docs, and I just left it all at that. So, really - no place to complain because I didn't really engage with the process, I just found it all much too unweildy. (and of course, I can't really think - with the exception of not using Google docs - of a better way it could have been done)

Lanza - no worries, it is an ancient entry, but it stopped me writing because I just couldn't understand why a site like this wanted to stifle a voice. It's not a biggie and it shouldn't be an edited entry anyway

WHat I find strange is to say, US American Researchers who write *on an American topic* should be able to keep the US spelling. I mean, why? Why not on any topic, or none

And, speaking a someone whose first language is not English, I must say I don't mind what spelling is used in each Entry (as long as it is consistent within the Entry). I don't have more or less difficulty reading something written in British, or US, or Canadian, or Australian, or South African, or whatever English. I can't believe a native UK English speaker would find it actually hard to read US English, nor the other way round*.

I'd even say it reinforces the Earth Edition aspect of the Guide. To each researcher their own voice! Yes, some bit of uniformity has to be kept, because we don't want the Guide to turn into an illegible hotchpotch. But really, is it so hard to understand that color means colour and doughnut donut**? (Yes, that example is probably a bit dishonest, so what? )

I see it as dialects. Of course there are bits I don't understand: expressions, measurements, whatever. I just get used to it: I can always google the meaning if I don't understand it from context, or just dismiss it as unimportant for my purpose (I won't care how much 15oz. are until I actually do the recipe). So I live and learn, get to know more cultures, to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where no one has gone before!

Ah, sorry, got carried away for a moment


* nor any other combination implied by my list, but you get the drift.

** amusingly, my spellchecker indicates both 'colour' and 'donut' as the wrong spellings

Beautifully put, there. In any spelling.

Ben

I was working on the bid.. *cough*

@Z - Yes, but I was replying to Sho's post, and didn't see yours until after I posted.

Here's a thing. If someone says "ten till two" what do they mean?

I would say that they were referring to the 4 hour period between 10am and 2pm.

1:50.

But if a person in the UK says, 'it's half 10', they mean 10:30, right?

Whereas me and all the Germans think you mean 9:30.

'If someone says "ten till two" what do they mean?'

I would say they meant either the four hour span of time or 1:50, depending on context.

I would experience not the slightest confusion by either of these sentences:

"I'll be there at ten till two"

and

"I was stuck on the plane from ten till two"


Furthermore, shouldn't it be "ten 'til two"? "'til" is an abbreviation of "until". "till" is a cash register.



(from now on I'm going to use "" in what I see as the proper way)

Until or till are both correct.

On the other hand, shouldn't you have written: "I was stuck on the 'plane from ten till two"?

I just thought of something. . .


recently I got a nice little freelance writing gig (for real money). Before given it, I was asked to show a bit of my writing. I didn't really think the academic stuff fit with their target audience, so I sent links to a number of my Edited Entries on "The BBC's Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy web site". I wonder if those pieces would have done as well for me if they were from "h2g2" and if they had a mishmash of spellings.


I really do think there is a justification to holding writers to a single standard, whatever that single standard might be.

On the subject of the 300 million potential U.S. readers (and ignoring for the moment that there are not 300 million people in the U.S. who can read English of any sort) I think a potential audience of over 2 billion British English readers are being ignored. I'm surprised the Commonwealth of Nations hasn't been mentioned.


Are potential readers *really* the reason behind this? Or is it just for the convenience of the plurality of U.S. volunteers?

>> Or is it just for the convenience of the plurality of U.S. volunteers?

Just to correct one small fact there - I think that this will lead to more work for the volunteers, not less.

The reputation of the site issue is an interesting one - we certainly have to consider how to maintain and grow a world-wide reputation.

Presumably the pieces themselves would have had excellent spelling throughout the pieces? Ie you would not have changed from one sort of spelling to another within the piece.

>> "'til" is an abbreviation of "until". "till" is a cash register.

Certainly, I'd assume consistency *within* an entry; so it should be written in British English, OR American English, OR Canadian English, etc. Probably also consistency in a suite of entries, say my University Project on Belief, and certainly Mu Beta's on Billy Joel. But most entries are stand alone, aren't they?

Here's another one.

"I'll work while tea".

B

but that's a difference between English as she is spoke and English as she should be written.

So while until, or even 'till would be ok in that sentence, while is dialect. Because if the Guide is going to be written in dialect I'll revert to Yorkshire.

(by the way - I'll send DDD over, he wrote an entry about cash registers as far as I remmber. Till refers to the coins in the drawer of the cash register as far as I remember...)

"you would not have changed from one sort of spelling to another within the piece. "

Of course. They were don't to the BBC standard. But, if they'd been done to a Canadian standard -- the standard of the Canadian Press, for example -- the spelling would have seemed to British or U.S. readers to be switching back and forth.



But I've moaned enough. I expect I've made it clear enough that I'm not much impressed with some of the directions being taken. But my opinion really shouldn't count for much -- I've never had time to volunteer (except in the form of writing entries).

>> but that's a difference between English as she is spoke and English as she should be written.

Agreed. I was just having fun. I love hearing actual local differences, for example when my colleagues talk about "the day" not "today", or someone in Gloucestershire calls their washing machine "he". Not heard that in a few decades though.

B

Writing entries is kinda important.

The idea of male washing machines boggles the mind.

Our is definitely female.

And, to whoever mentioned it, I use h2g2 for 'writing samples' all the time. In the US. I just mention, 'this is a British website.' I've never had a complaint, they're always impressed with the site.

>> But, if they'd been done to a Canadian standard -- the standard of the Canadian Press, for example -- the spelling would have seemed to British or U.S. readers to be switching back and forth.

So what? My thought is that a piece written by a Canadian about a Canadia subject should be in Canadian English, and devil take the u.

The Guide Editors' opinions may differ - Gnomon mentioned not supporting Hibernian English, for example.

We're constrianed by the skills, languages and availability of our volunteers of course.

*hmmmmm*

*Wonders if we could get Teuchter to write about Aberdeen in the Doric*

*Wonders if we *should* get Teuchter to write about Aberdeen in the Doric*

*Realises she ought to butt the bleep out before one of the Guide Eds bops her over the head and buries her in a wood*

I am in favour of supporting Scots, but we'd need subeditors. Want to volunteer?

Not me. I'm almost as English as it's possible to be.