A Conversation for How to be the perfect mistress

A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 41

Rainbow

As a woman I cannot say for sure what makes a man want a mistress. However, I believe that quite a large number of men quite simply find it extremely difficult to be monogamous and also in my experience certain men, who are successful in business and comfortably off look for some excitement/a challenge/distraction in their lives and they get this by having a affair.


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 42

Simon the Silly Sausage (Gone AWOL from h2g2)

Eeeek!
In sucessful in business and pretty comfortably off.
Lucky I have h2g2 to give me some excitement and distraction smiley - smiley
Phew!

Being serious, you are right rainbow, alot of people, not just men, find it hard to be monogomous, but I still think it is fairer if we end one relationship before we start a new one. Otherwise you are being greedy!

I don't think mistresses are bad, there a probably millions of examples where they have happy relationships with married men that work out just great. Every circumstance is different.
But I do still object to the idea of anyone seeking to intervene in an existing monogomous relationship purely for self gratification. That is a selfish thing to do.


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 43

Rainbow

Simon, you seem to forget that an enormous amount of people who are in relationships are not 'in love', they are just enjoying mutual affection.

Love, in my opinion, is overrated - it makes you fall for someone to whom you are totally unsuited, and then when the love dies (as it frequently does), you are left with nothing. I believe friendship, affection and mutual respect are more important and far more enduring.


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 44

Rainbow

Another simulpost!!

All too often ending a relationship (i.e. a marriage) is not that simple especially if there are children involved. Most married men who have affairs would never want to destroy the entire family by splitting it up, and amazingly most wives, whose husbands have affairs would rather forgive them, than divorce them. You would be amazed by how many wives know of their husband's adultery, but chose to turn a blind eye to it, rather than disrupt their domestic arrangements.


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 45

Simon the Silly Sausage (Gone AWOL from h2g2)

Friendship, affection, mutual respect and trust (to add one to your list) are the most important things you can build a relationship on.
I totally agree that without them the love soon dies and you are left with nothing.

I am sad you feel love is overrated, it can lead you to do some stupid things, but it can also be the most wondeful experience imaginable.

If the entry had listed any of the above as reasons to be a mistress, perhaps I could sympathise more, as it stands it seems to suggest you do it to recieve attention, feel wanted, and get laid. Hardly the basis for an enduring partnership.


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 46

Rainbow

The entry said "Choose a man who makes you feel wonderful; choose a man who makes you laugh" this was meant to suggest that you choose a man who likes and respects you enough to make you feel good about yourself, and someone who is a friend with whom you can laugh and relax. Perhaps we should have been more specific.

smiley - rainbow


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 47

Just an innocent bystander

"I can't think of any reason aside from a failing marriage/relationship, and by your guidelines I would think this is a guy potential mistresses should avoid since he'll be looking for love, companionship, ect. from someone else since he's not getting it in his current relationship."

This is not necessarily always the case. Going outside a current relationship is not always caused because the relationship is *lacking* anything, it can also be that the mistress relationship is *adding* something that, by pure definition, can't be found in the "regular" relationship. To give a very simple example : the initial courting phase in a relationship is considered by most to be fun and exciting. Although there are people that suggest you should continue making this same effort throughout your relationship, most people tend to find this increasingly difficult as the years go by. Even couples that claim to still be extremely in love after years will (if they're honest) have to admit that it's just not the same as it was in the beginning. Moreover, the entire basis for the fun and excitement (which is that you do not *know* each other yet) is absent after a while. Finding a mistress will allow a man (or a woman) to relive this excitement, pure and simple.

So it's not only men who find themselves in a failing or lacking relationship that would be looking for a mistress. I have seen various cases in which the mistress relationship was actually helping and strengthening the regular relationship. Of course I've seen a few that totally wrecked the regular as well...smiley - erm

The reasons to look for/stumble upon a mistress are too numerous to even start listing them and range from pure ego to ... whatever. I think it would be fair to say, however, that physical attraction is an important factor in the majority of cases.

I'm not judging on the morality of having an affair and I'm certainly not saying that men only have affairs out of noble motives, but your question was "what's the man getting out of it?". Just trying to show that it's not always someone who's in misery over his current relationship.

JAIB


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 48

Simon the Silly Sausage (Gone AWOL from h2g2)

The reasons for finding or being a mistress are too numberous to list.
And therefore, it isn't really practical to praise or condemn them, because each case will have it's own merits and circumstances.

The reason JAIB mentions, that the initial excitement dissapears wit time, so many people look for it in other places raises the argument that if we all did this, there would never be any stable relationships anywhere to raise our offspring in.

Married men and women will look to have affairs, it's human instinct to seek a new potential mate after enough time has passed for children to become independent, usually around 4-7 years.
If there were no people willing to play host to those seeking affairs, would they still have them? Or would they make more of an effort with thier current partners?


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 49

Just an innocent bystander

Like I said, the reasons are too numerous to list and vary for each individual and situation.

The point about "if we all did this" is entirely true. But I feel you regard "having an affair" as the intermediary step for "switching partners". As I tried to indicate, in many cases this is not what is intended by the person having the affair : it's meant to (piecefully) co-exist with the regular relationship.

Of course, it's extremely different to generalize on this subject as there are so many variations on the theme it's impossible to cover all aspects.

In short, I think we will agree that people will have affairs, regardless of what you and I think of it. In that light, I think this Entry gives some useful advice on how to go about it without hurting anybody in the process.

I do agree with you however, that I would object to the Entry if it would proclaim that "being a mistress" is "the way to go". I can sympathize if someone is placed in that position by fate or circumstance and trying to make the best of it (with help from the entry). But I don't subscribe to the idea that you should preferably target married men/women since they provide the best hassle/pleasure ratio on the market. Then you might as well target single men/women where no other party is likely to get hurt in the process. But that's not what I'm reading from this Entry. (Correct me if I'm wrong Ben, Rainbow)


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 50

Just an innocent bystander

"different" should be "difficult". How about previewing eh ?
smiley - winkeye


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 51

a girl called Ben

Blimey, a backlog and a half. It is good to see so many honest questions, and I have tried to give honest answers. Simon has asked a lot about morality in particular, and those (for me) are the most difficult questions, because I do have qualms.

Lucinda suggested I put in links to some of my poems in the entry, there are links to all of them in the 'Poetry' section of my home page. However, I am putting links to the most relavent at the bottom of this post.

smiley - handcuffs

Simon, in post 28 you asked: "what exactly is in it for the mistress? You may get alot of attention and plenty of sex for a while, but that can be obtained from any man. Why is there a desire to go after a man who is already in a relationship with another woman?"

Simple - it is not just men that can be commitment-phobes. I like part-time relationships, my life simply does not have room for a partner just now.

"Does any womn really want to sleep with a man for a short period of time and then move on to the next one?
"

Yes.

"What about forming a bond, a partnership, sharing your life with someone, comitment, trust, fidelity."

Been there, done that, got the divorce papers. A675083

smiley - handcuffs

Jimmi X - post 29: "What's in it for the man? I mean, why would a man seek a mistress?"

A811405:

Don't worry,
He's yours.
I'm something to do when the evening is past,
he doesn't drink brandy or smoke big cigars:
I'm a way to round off the occasional night.

Don't worry.
He's yours.
You're his anchor, his mainstay, the core of his life.
You've got two lovely boys, you're a wonderful wife;
but he likes to cut-loose on the occasional night.

Simply put, a lot of men find domesticity too taming, they like to feel like lads again.

smiley - handcuffs

Simon - post 31: "the only kind of guy a mistress is going to attract are the types that would cheat on thier wives, and they are hardly the types this entry outlines as being ideal targets. You'd have to sift though a lot of detritus before you found Mr Right this way."

And a quote from the entry itself: "Don't let him fall in love with you. This is one of the ground-rules you should set out at the start of the affair. Make it clear that you want his body, his company, his attention, and some of his time, but that you do not want commitment, you won't let him damage his marriage, and you will end it if he falls in love."

The whole point is that you have, and deliberately and artificially prolong, the pleasure of courting, but you don't go for commitment. As Rainbow and I have already indicated, and I am sure Magnolia would agree, there are times in a woman's life when she wants to feel wonderful, but does not want to run the risks of commitment.

smiley - handcuffs

Lucinda, post 33 - I will cheapen the burglar for you if you like! smiley - winkeye

smiley - handcuffs

Simon, post 36 - "Can't you find a single man to get to know? How does interferring in the marriage of another woman, jeapordising the stable family life that his children have constitute no baggage? That would weigh seriously on my conscience."

Ah. The nub of the question, and where we skate on thin ice. Yes, it does weigh with my conscience, as the poem quoted above indicates. The link: A811405 will take you to the whole of the poem.

But it IS possible to have an affair that does no harm. And if no harm is done, what harm is done?

smiley - handcuffs

Jimmi X, post 39 - "Why does a man seek a mistress? I'm having trouble thinking of any reason aside from a failing marriage/relationship, and by your guidelines in the entry I would think this is a guy who potential mistresses should avoid since he'll be looking for love, companionship, ect. from someone else since he's not getting it in his current relationship..."

Not so much love, companionship, etc. The guys I have had affairs with have wanted someone to listen to them talk (often ad nauseam) about their work, someone who won't make demands, who won't phone them, who will call her own plumber, who will not complain about their socks, (yes I really DO have a thing about socks)! The want someone who will make them feel good with no downside. This is an artificial situation, but so long as you both know it is an artificial situation, it works very well. Oh, and fabulous sex, but that goes without saying.

smiley - handcuffs

Simon, post 40 - "Just ... questioning how much guilt you would feel for being a mistress."

Some.

But as a friend of mine said at university: "I love f**king catholic girls, they always feel so much guilt" That can be a trip too, I guess.


Simon, same post - "To imply you become a mistress to seek romace and passion hints that you are also seeking love, don't the three go hand in hand?"

No.

There is something incredibly relaxing about not being in love with the person you are sleeping with.

Simon, same post - "if you are stuck in an unhappy relationship, and considering sleeping with somebody else, wouldn't it be fairer to end the unhappy relationship first?"

Yes.

smiley - handcuffs

Simon, post 42 - "But I do still object to the idea of anyone seeking to intervene in an existing monogomous relationship purely for self gratification. That is a selfish thing to do."

Um.

It isn't as if we have to tie them up, you know. Or not unwillingly anyway. smiley - winkeye

smiley - handcuffs

Rainbow, post 44 - "You would be amazed by how many wives know of their husband's adultery, but chose to turn a blind eye to it, rather than disrupt their domestic arrangements."

Yes, and there are the guilt-gifts too, of course. I wouldn't have minded some of those diamonds and the mink coat, for example.

smiley - handcuffs

Simon, post 45 - "I am sad you feel love is overrated, it can lead you to do some stupid things, but it can also be the most wondeful experience imaginable. "

I know.

smiley - handcuffs

Innocent Bystander, post 47 - "Going outside a current relationship is not always caused because the relationship is *lacking* anything, it can also be that the mistress relationship is *adding* something that, by pure definition, can't be found in the "regular" relationship."

Absolutely.

smiley - handcuffs

Simon - post 48 "If there were no people willing to play host to those seeking affairs, would they still have them?"

Interesting question. But I get a huge amount out of being a mistress, not financially, (I paid for lunch today, for example), but in other ways. I feel great, I feel admired, desired, respected, enjoyed, pleasured, and so on. And all we did today was have lunch and kiss. I guess being a mistress is as flattering to my ego, as having a mistress is to his.

smiley - handcuffs

Innocent Bystander - post 50 " I don't subscribe to the idea that you should preferably target married men/women since they provide the best hassle/pleasure ratio on the market. Then you might as well target single men/women where no other party is likely to get hurt in the process."

Unfortunately a lot of people get hurt in relationships where there are only the two of you. I suspect that many people who have affairs, either as the man or the mistress, have experienced this already.

smiley - handcuffs

For the record, I do not rule out having a partnership again, but not yet, not now, and not here.

Ben

Relavent Poems:

Carbohydrates cure the blues: A601228
Treading the earth lightly: A675074
The occasional night: A811405


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 52

Just an innocent bystander

"Unfortunately a lot of people get hurt in relationships where there are only the two of you. I suspect that many people who have affairs, either as the man or the mistress, have experienced this already."

Can't argue here. But at least both parties know they stand the chance to get hurt and decide to take the risk, while the husband/wife in a mistress situation does not have any say in the matter.

"For the record, I do not rule out having a partnership again, but not yet, not now, and not here."

No one is saying that you should. smiley - smiley
Let me be clear, I do not convict anybody for being a mistress or having an affair - at least not without knowing the circumstances - but I would mind if you were actually advising people to actively strive for a mistress position because that would be indirect advice to hurt an "innocent" bystander (pun not intended).

I didn't think that was what you were trying to do. Are you ?


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 53

Jimi X

smiley - cheers Ben.

I just couldn't put that together this morning - being a lad again is a bit outside my experience... smiley - winkeye

- a peter-pan syndrome named Jimi


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 54

a girl called Ben

Innocent Bystander - "I would mind if you were actually advising people to actively strive for a mistress position because that would be indirect advice to hurt an "innocent" bystander (pun not intended).

I didn't think that was what you were trying to do. Are you ?"

No.

But if you are going to do a thing, for goodness sake do it well. This entry tells you how to be a mistress in such a way that both get maximum pleasure out of the arrangement, and in such a way that the risk of pain is minimised.

There is a difference between being a mistress, and having a love affair. Love affairs, by definition, involve love. And I have seen too many women reeling years or even decades after their husbands went off with a floozie to condone that action. I thank the goddess I intermittanly manifest as that my ex left me because he did not want to be married to me, and did not leave me because he had found someone else.

This entry is about protecting the wife in as much as it is about anything, as I hope it makes clear.

B


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 55

Just an innocent bystander

That's exactly what I figured, thanks. Got confused a little by your sparring with Silly Sausage (who had some good points nevertheless).

Let the editors come and take it I say. This is as balanced as an entry covering this subject is likely to get smiley - ok


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 56

a girl called Ben

Simon has some excellent points. I do have to say that it is good to see debate on this subject, rather than moralising. Five years or so ago I would have agreed with him on almost all of them.

B


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 57

a girl called Ben

While I am spamming this thread with my poetry, I thought I would post this one here, since it is relavent and short. It is not autobiographical, but it is about the reaction of an aging wife about the woman her husband left her for. I forgot it because it was listed in the poems about my marriage, not in the ones about relationships I have had and not had since.

Best served cold

In my anger, I wanted you to die,
but revenge tastes sweeter yearly, watching you.
You suffer now, no matter how you try.
In my anger I wanted you to die.
Your looks have crumbled, your health has gone, you cry
in pain, (as I did the first time I met you).
In my anger, I wanted you to die,
but revenge tastes sweeter yearly, watching you.

28th September 2002

a mass of contradictions called Ben


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 58

Simon the Silly Sausage (Gone AWOL from h2g2)

Wow Ben, Thank you for taking the time to respond to just about every point I made.
I still hope no one thinks I am moralising, just trying to look at things from a few different angles.
I think you summed it all up very well by saying there is a vast difference between a love affair and a mistress. Being a mistress will obviously not suit every woman.
While I think the entry is very comprehensive and well balanced, I still got the overall impression that it was promoting the idea as a better alternative to a loving relationship. I think the entry would stand better if it was made clearer that this was advise on how to be the best mistress if that is what you want to be.

After reading your reply I can agree that being a mistress can be a beneficial thing for all parties concerned. And if circumstances do put you in that situation, you should strive to be your best at it.
If no one else thinks this entry encourages women to deliberatly target married men as a better alternative to single ones, I am happy for it to go in the guide.


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 59

a girl called Ben

Well, both you and Innocent Bystander had the same questions, or questions raised by the same concern, anyway, and the section on moral dilemmas at the end is incredibly weak as it currently stands, as I knew when it was written.

It shall be beefed up, so that it draws the distinction for the man (and therefore his wife) between having a mistress and having love affair, and also saying that this is a how-to-guide, and not promotional material, and also that it is not a recommendation to target married men.

Moralising is ok, by the way Simon. I do it myself on a regular basis. What I do - which is exactly what you did here - is accept that the other person is big enough and bad enough to make up their own minds on the subject, but put forward my concerns and questions. But moralising *is* fine. The world would fall apart without morality.

B


A872831 - How to be the perfect mistress

Post 60

a girl called Ben

Another bloody contradiction, sorry.

In post 56 I should have added 'smug, self-satisfied, judgemental' before the word 'moralising'.

The moral concerns which have been put forward here have been none of the above; anything but.

It is nice to know you guys still respect us in the morning! smiley - winkeye

B


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