h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Imagine if weather forecasts were written like Horoscopes:



High pressure giving us sunshine across most of the South East - a good day for a picnic in the Home Counties.



Don't expect to enjoy cricket this afternoon; you will find that it
will be overcast in the morning, and with heavy rain later in the day.



A great day for gardening; last nights scattered showers followed by today's sunshine mean that the ground is ripe for planting out seedlings.



My point here is that horoscopes (and I mean the individual ones, not the newspaper ones) don't PREDICT that you will have a picnic in the home counties, miss the cricket or grow a lovely row of beans.

They just give illustrations of the sort of behaviour suitable to the 'weather' around you.



That comment on linguistics and stylistics aside, I find horoscopes and sun-signs an interesting way of focussing the attention on something or someone.

An example: a friend of mine turns out to be a Virgo - this was a surprise to me, because he is proactive rather than reactive, but on the other hand he is patient, loyal and a sticker. I knew all of these things already, but it was interesting to view him in this light.

If he had turned out to be an Aries I would have focussed on his energy, determination and his ballsiness.

The point I mean to make is that my attention is focussed by this way of looking at people. Some people are a surprise and don't fit their signs, and in many ways these are the most interesting, because you may find something that you missed.

I have to say that I find characterisation by sun-sign an interesting, useful and seductively accurate way of defining character and behaviour.

a gullible fool called Ben

Unlike yourself,i prefer to judge
a persons personality by what i see
and hear and not by pre-judging
how they will act according to
their star sign as you seem to do.

Um. No I don't.

"This was a surprise to me ... but it was interesting to view him in this light."

In that case, it's a good job I don't judge people on what they post.

I don't believe a word of any of this kind of thing and cannot see how this astrology malarkey could possibly work. How could the apparent positions of the planets among the stars (at time of birth or today) affect our lives and why should they? (What are the mechanics behind it all and what is the influencing force which moulds our behaviour) I would really, really, honestly like someone who understands and believes in all of this to take time to explain how it is supposed to work. (any takers?)
Maybe wrongly categorising and labelling people could be a bad thing if they are not what we believe that they should be.
Isn't astrology just an elaborate but futile attempt to make some sense of (or control?) human behaviour?

Wish the weather was controllable though.

An unbeliever called Ommigosh

Hi Ommi-G

"Maybe wrongly categorising and labelling people could be a bad thing if they are not what we believe that they should be."

I don't think that my friend is reactive now that I know he is a Virgo - I know he isn't.

Ben

Hi Ben
My guess is that the more people you know well and whose star signs you can be bothered to find out about, the more it will become obvious that they just don't fit into the accepted personality types as defined by the star-signs (are there 12?). Is that not your experience? - You said that you have found it useful. I really wrote it all off when no-one I knew seemed to fit their star signs very well.

Having said that, I suppose astrology must go a lot further than just describing 12 types of people though. That might just be a simplified approach to something that is a lot more complex.

Wel, I don't get het up about it, and I CERTAINLY don't evangelise - hell, I don't evangelise about the things I do beleive in.

But Star Signs are a socially acceptable, easily discovered, semi-random element to introduce to one's thinking.

It is SO easy to get stuck in a rut with one's thinking, and rattle along on the surface with presuppositions and prejudice, that introducing a random element and using it to test and undermine those presuppositions and prejudices helps.

The random element could just as easily be the 4th roadsign on the left that you see this morning:

"No Overtaking" - what does that tell me about this person? Is he following a narrow path? We-ell he is not intending to divert from he is taking at the moment. Does he take life at high speed, could he overtake if it was safe? He has lots of energy, but I would not say that much changes in his life year on year. How well does he handle opposition and things coming in the opposite direction? He tends to get stuck and frustrated, but he does tend to deal with it very effectively, he uses frustration as a motive force. (This is all the Virgo mentioned above, btw).

So I am using something to dig out stuff I already know and bring it forward to the light.

It could be an item of office stationery; how like a stapler is he?

Does he hold things together? Does he need refilling/external motivation? Is what he does easy or hard to undo? How essential is he in his environment, how annoying/upsetting is it for others if he is not around?

It could be the first car I see in the morning. How like a Renault Laguna is this man?

Do you see what I am doing? I am applying a set of tests and doing some free associations to dig out surprises, I am NOT saying "Astrology says he is a Virgo - therefore he must be reactive, despite the fact that I know he is actually very proactive."

Having said that; I prefer to test it the other way round - what star sign do I think so-and-so is? My accuracy is more than 1 in 12, but not sufficiently near 1:1 for me to want to say that sun-signs are an accurate way of defining people.

an aries called Ben

There is a tiny little problem with the sort of astrology (horoscopes) being talked about in this thread. Only the Sun sign is being taken into account. When the Moon and eight other planets are figured in it suddenly gets a lot more accurate.

For example Virgos are reactive! What Ben sees, though, is more likely to be the person's Moon sign - and if that's Aries, for instance, then the person will be proactive with knobs on! But Cancer, Libra and Capricorn are other strong possibilities.

Just a little tip: if you look at newspaper or magazine Sun-sign columns and you happen to know what your Ascendant (rising sign) is, take a look at that as well. You may find it much more accurate!

Well, I am an Aries, (very very Aries in fact), which is one of the reasons I was astonished to find he is a Virgo.

I could find out the details, if I could be bothered, I guess.

I'd lay my money on Aries or Capricorn rather than Cancer or Libra. What about Leo or Taurus?

B

"But Star Signs are a socially acceptable, easily discovered, semi-random element to introduce to one's thinking.

It is SO easy to get stuck in a rut with one's thinking, and rattle along on the surface with presuppositions and prejudice, that introducing a random element and using it to test and undermine those presuppositions and prejudices helps."

Right, I see where you are coming from now. What a neat idea. Must try it.
I guess taht the (alleged) star sign personality profiles which have been built up over the years (even if they might be based on nothing more than superstition) must provide quite a wealth of information to draw upon when doing these analyses thingies of the people around you.

Not having studied it very deeply, I wonder if there is has been agreement amongst astrolgers the world over and down through the ages about what a Capritarious or Saggiwhatsit should be like if his sun or moon sign is in Libricorn.

Om (stuck in a rut).

Yes, there is agreement among astrologers about the way in which the Moon sign will influence the Sun sign. One explanation is that the Sun sign shows how a person will act; the Moon sign is the way in which a person will react. As most of us spend about 95 per cent of the time using the Moon (reacting) rather than the Sun (acting) then what is seen and felt is the Moon - which is one reason why a lot of people don't think they are 'typical' of their Sun signs.

Pity, really...

It becomes even more complex when you look at the aspects between planets.

The primary signifier is the Ascendant (harder ot find out that the sun sign) depicting the outward personality - appearance, behaviour and relationships. The manifested personality. Aspects to the Asc. and ruling planet affect the physical body, the brain and mental outlook.

The Sun comes next and shows the ego or fundermental character which may or may not be like the surface personality shown by the ascendant. The basic character. Aspects modify the individual characteristics.

The Moon's sign shows the desire-nature, subconscious psychological tendancies and how the person will react to or feel about things. The emotional nature. Aspects modify personal characteristics.

Mercury indicates the type of mentality or thought process. Quickness, braininess, flow of words etc.
Venus - Artistic tastes, sociability, charm etc.
Mars - Virility, courage aggression etc.
Jupiter - Optimism, generosity etc.
Saturn - Pessimism, profundity etc.
Uranus - Inspiration, eccentricity etc.
Neptune - Mysticism, fantasy etc.
Pluto - Mediumship (not mucn known about the infuence of Pluto)

Alji

(Returning after a long time away)

Not much known about Pluto?

Power is what Pluto is about. Power and control of that power.

Also rules Scorpio - so that brings birth, death, sex and mega-change into things.

And big money operations, too.

Rules underground stuff - mines, sewers, caves and the like.

Mediumship is more like Neptune...