A Conversation for The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Peer Review: A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Started conversation Nov 15, 2003
Entry: The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage - A2045594
Author: Frenchbean - The Answer to the Ultimate Question - U236943
This is one of those stories I've always been fascinated by. The entry was sparked off by a visit to the National Maritime Museum, where I saw some of the artifacts found all those years later.
Peering comments?
Frenchbean
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Ausnahmsweise, wie üblich (Consistently inconsistent) Posted Nov 15, 2003
Hi again french Bean,
I read a book on the subject 10 or 12 years ago. I thought the lead poisoning theory had been proven. Didn't they do autopsies? (One body they exhumed had already had one - performed by the ship's doctor.)
Sounds like that book was just speculation, or has since been disputed?
Awu
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Old Hairy Posted Nov 15, 2003
Hello. An interesting read.
Just two minor points.
In the first sentence under the heading "Franklin's Final Expedition" there is a typo: "once a for all" -> "once and for all".
At the end, you mention the Capes, although you did not mention the Cape of Good Hope by name (you just described it).
Hope this helps.
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 15, 2003
Hi Awu
The bodies that they exhumed were the 3 at Victory Point and did show evidence of lead poisoning, but as I understand it, that would not cause death. However, it would have made them pretty ill - probably leading to death through starvation/other causes. Where's a when you need one?
So that diagnosis hasn't been disputed: it's just that there were 126 others, all of whom also died. I don't think that any other bones have been studied.
The big effort at the moment seems to be to find the wrecks of Erebus and Terror - presumably because they may hold clues to what happened.
F/b
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 15, 2003
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Florida Sailor All is well with the world Posted Nov 15, 2003
Good entry FB.
One site I find useful for Royal Navy sailing ships is;
http://www.cronab.demon.co.uk/INTRO.HTM
It is a little cumbersome to navigate but has some interesting info.
Just to pick a little,
> It consisted of the first Arctic-bound ships with screw propellers, Erebus and Terror, 129 officers and men. They sailed out of Portsmouth in May 1845.<
This makes it sound like both ships were brand new and had the latest technology. Actually Erebus was built in 1826 and Terror dated back to 1813! Both were 'Bomb vessels' which means they were ships specially equipped to carry large mortars in place of their front mast. Both ships explored the Southern ocean together in 1841 under Captain James Clark ROSS. They discovered the Ross Sea and Ice Shelf and claimed Antarctica for the UK as 'Victoria Land'
Both ships were fitted with engines and a 'lifting propeller' just before the expedition in 1845. The lifting propeller was designed so that it could be hoisted into a slot in the hull for protection and to eliminate drag while the ship was under sail.
It might also be a good idea to mention that they sailed with provisions intended to last for 3 years.
>and a mysterious cairn, made entirely of more than 700 gravel-filled cans that had contained the expedition's meat, suggesting that much of their food had spoiled.<
Actually that would only be 5 ½ cans per man, is that really so unusual for several months?
F S
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Nov 15, 2003
This is a very interesting entry, and very well written. I couldn't find any typos in it at all!
I'm not 100% happy with the way you describe the Northwest Passage as "the navigable route ...". It's not really navigable, except by ice-breakers and a lot of luck. The entry gives the impression that there was a route and they just didn't find it. In fact Canada went much further north than they expected and there really was not navigable route, and certainly nothing that would have even compared with the 'ease' of rounding Cape Horn, never mind the Panama Canal.
Good Work!
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 16, 2003
Ah my wonderful Peers, FS and Gnomon
Good comments.
Thanks for the info about Erebus and Terror. I knew they were Bomb ships, but I didn't know when they were built, nor that they had been adapted over the years. I shall add something to take account of that.
On the canned meat front: I kind of assumed that the 700+ cans found were those left over when they got there. Wouldn't they have chucked any other empties, or spoiled, cans over the side en route? And presumably they'd have been expecting to get seals, auks (which they were seen shooting), fish once they were in the ice? I am displaying a complete ignorance of how much food an expedition of this sort would take with them I'm afraid!
Reading it again, it does sound as though the Nw Passage is passable: I'll edit it, so that it isn't misleading.
No typos -
Frenchbean
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 16, 2003
Gnomon and FS
Edits done.
Can you check what I've done and see if the changes have improved it please?
F/b
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Nov 16, 2003
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
McKay The Disorganised Posted Nov 17, 2003
Very good Didn't Franklin's widow prompt the navy search ? I seem to recall reading somehwere they were initially just going to write him off, but she shamed them into making the search.
(This is a memory only and I could well have confused my expeditions.)
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 17, 2003
Oh no! A typo I'll sort it
Hi McKay
Lady Franklin never wrote him off and she certainly got the non-naval searches off the ground after 1857. I haven't seen anything about her shaming the Navy into looking for him. Do you have a source for that info? I'll add something if it can be verified.
F/b
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Florida Sailor All is well with the world Posted Nov 17, 2003
Did a little googling FB.
>And is there any significance in the fact that this was the first expedition to carry canned food supplies?<
This is not true;
http://www.cannedfood.org/history.html
shows a can carried by Parry's expedition to the Arctic 1824.
A good account of the story can be found at;
http://www.ric.edu/rpotter/franklife.html
a book review adds a bit of info on the cans at;
http://sale-for-you.com/books/details/0471377902/Ice,Blink:,The,Tragic,Fate,of,Sir,John,Franklin,s,Lost,Polar,Expedition.html
One I found most interesting is a Canadian site;
http://www.mysteriesofcanada.com/Nunavut/franklin_expedition.htm
Back to the pile of cans
>On the canned meat front: I kind of assumed that the 700+ cans found were those left over when they got there. Wouldn't they have chucked any other empties, or spoiled, cans over the side en route? And presumably they'd have been expecting to get seals, auks (which they were seen shooting), fish once they were in the ice? I am displaying a complete ignorance of how much food an expedition of this sort would take with them I'm afraid!<
The Canadian articale says that Franklin contracted for 8,000 cans from Goldner, assuming that this was to last 36 months ( 3 years ) that would be a consumption of 222 cans per month, so the 700+ cans found would be a little over 3 month's usage which sounds right to me for a winter's encampment. I am assuming the "gravel filled cans" had been opened and emptied. There is no way to determine that the food was discarded instead of being eaten, except it would be folley to continue into the unknown if you knew your food supply was unreliable.
It is possible that the cans were all emptied and eaten on site and then piled into the carin so they could be retrieved and traded with the Innuit, if neccesary, for the return voyage.
I know that before canned food stores were carried in casks with wooden staves held by iron bands. The common practice was to disassemle the empty casks and return them at the end of the voyage so they could be re-assembled. I am not sure if there was any value in returning the cans to the manufacturer for a re-use credit. As a Royal Navy expedition Franklin would be required to account for anything of value. They would have been considered quite valuable by the Innuits for cooking and storage.
Any ship at this time would try to get as much fresh food as possible to suplement their diet, but it would not be depended upon for survival. Although may ships did rely of fishing the average sailor was quite superstitious and thought catching fish to be bad luck.
I do not disagree that the cans caused a large part of the disaster, I just think the argument can be better made.
I would metion the age of the ships ( 19 and 32 years respectfuly ). The age of the ships and the number of hard months in Arctic waters may have caused the loss of the ships. The fact that both had been fitted with engines and propellers just before this voyage should be pointed out as mechanical failure may be another part of the mystrey.
F S
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 17, 2003
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 17, 2003
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 18, 2003
Hey FS:
Do you think it reads better now I've re-slanted the argument a bit? I decided to reduce the controversy linked to the cans. The Canadian link really puts a lot more emphasis on the fact that they probably starved, rather than died of lead poisoning/botulism - although both those causes of death are still possibles for some of the crew at least.
F/b
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
Florida Sailor All is well with the world Posted Nov 18, 2003
Very good Frenchbean. It makes the entry more of a mystery.
I wonder if a few of the effects of lead poisoning might be worthwhile, effecting judgement and causing lethargy?
Here are a couple links that might help
http://www.lead-poisoning-news.com/html/effects.html
http://www.wilentzpersonalinjurylawyers.com/toxic_chemical_personal_injury/lead_poisoning/medical_effects.html
A search for botulism was not as productive, but a look at "Tabor's Cyclopedic Medical Dictionary" shows;
"Poisoning: The toxin has a selective action on the central nervous system. In fatal cases, cardiac and respiratory paralysis occur through involvement of the medullary centers."
Symptoms include "fatigue, weakness, dizziness, headaches and digestive complaints..."
Sounds like a likely contributing factor.
Another thing that might be of interest on the North West Passage is;
http://www.kilts.co.nz/longship.htm
Rumors that Vikings may have sailed through the passage may have added to the reason for the extended search for the north west passage.
F S
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 19, 2003
Hello FS
I've added a couple of links - vikings and lead poisoning. a whole website about lead poisoning: is it more of a worldwide problem than I realised?
Also a footnote about botulism poisoning.
Also I've added you as a researcher on this entry, since you've done such a huge amount of peering and googling for it. I hope you don't mind
Frenchbean
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
frenchbean Posted Nov 19, 2003
I don't understand why your name FS, came out under written and researched and mine under edited.
I've not done that bit before. Can anybody help?
F/b
A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
sprout Posted Nov 19, 2003
Hello fellow vegetable!
It's a bit of a bug in the system. When this becomes an edited guide article you will both be under 'written and researched' in order of when you joined the site. The sub-editor will go under 'edited by'.
It's not very satisfactory and it has been on the list for improvement for ages.
I really enjoyed the article by the way, I'd never really understood where the NW passage was (or in the end wasn't) before.
sprout
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Peer Review: A2045594 - The Mystery of The Franklin Expedition to the Northwest Passage
- 1: frenchbean (Nov 15, 2003)
- 2: Ausnahmsweise, wie üblich (Consistently inconsistent) (Nov 15, 2003)
- 3: Old Hairy (Nov 15, 2003)
- 4: frenchbean (Nov 15, 2003)
- 5: frenchbean (Nov 15, 2003)
- 6: Florida Sailor All is well with the world (Nov 15, 2003)
- 7: Gnomon - time to move on (Nov 15, 2003)
- 8: frenchbean (Nov 16, 2003)
- 9: frenchbean (Nov 16, 2003)
- 10: Gnomon - time to move on (Nov 16, 2003)
- 11: McKay The Disorganised (Nov 17, 2003)
- 12: frenchbean (Nov 17, 2003)
- 13: Florida Sailor All is well with the world (Nov 17, 2003)
- 14: frenchbean (Nov 17, 2003)
- 15: frenchbean (Nov 17, 2003)
- 16: frenchbean (Nov 18, 2003)
- 17: Florida Sailor All is well with the world (Nov 18, 2003)
- 18: frenchbean (Nov 19, 2003)
- 19: frenchbean (Nov 19, 2003)
- 20: sprout (Nov 19, 2003)
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