h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I'm sorry, but my food didn't produce me. Apparently we have really different definitions of this word.

But when people are talking about human reproduction in particular, they don't talk about food or oxygen, do they? So there seems to be a significant ingredient missing with fire 'reproduction'.

well, grow as in start from small and get larger, was what I had in mind -- possibly along with change in adulthood.

Forget the ex thing, it was meant to be a joke but apparently you have to have been there

hmm seems to me that this takes care of mountains, which are upthrust in cataclysmic events not born then small then adult. Fire is more questionable.

However, my point is that it really doesn't matter if fires and mountains are alive -- we can't talk to them anyway. Maybe there are entire civilizations on the dust motes in that beam of sunlight, but they can't perceive me and I can't perceive them so the point cannot be proved either pro or con.

Has anyone heard of Nanobes?
Dr. Philippa Uwins (University of Queensland) believes she has descovered activley growing nanobacteria in rocks. It was previously believed that nanobacteria are too small to harbour the enzymatic and genetic material considered essential for life.

This is interesting, as this was one of the points that discredited the Martian meteorite. The fossil found inside was said to have been too small to have been life. Maybe not?

Does life on other planets have to be of the sort that we can communicate with or even find intelligent as we understand it?

Personally finding any life at all would be a significant leap...I think people expect too much of the 'little green man' idea, we may not be the only life in the universe, but we may be the only significantly intelligent life.

That draws us to another question, how does one rate intelligence?

I'm not saying it does. I'm just pointing out that without food or oxygen you're not likely to reproduce.

but oxygen may not be necessary if you aren't carbon-based, though...

Speaking of which, has anyone seen Evolution? I just saw it last night. It's a very intelligent, very funny spoof of American culture, and by the way the aliens start out as single-celled organisms in a sort of meteorite ooze. They feed on fire and choke in oxygen, though the later nasties manage to evolve into something that can breathe our air. I probably don't know enough to evaluate the scientific hypotheses, but it all sounded plausible to this semi-literate layperson...

Maybe not. I would be interested in looking at this research, if you have a link...

Here you go

http://www.uq.edu.au/nanoworld/uwins.html
There's some really cool pictures, if nothing else.

thanks.

I enjoyed the link. It may be that the rest of this conversation is seeking to define the undefinable... though personally I find that conclusion rather unsatisfying.

Agreed.

I would agree that evolution is a belief, as is my belief that the computer I am typing on exists.

it is not possible to really know that anything really is real or exists, up to and including yourself and so evolution is a belief. but it is not a belief in the same sense as religions are (and I mean any religion, not just christianity). religious beliefs are beliefs regardless or in spite of, or even because of lack of evidence or evidense to the contrary. wheras evolution was formed through looking at evidense and coming to a conclusion that fits the evidense without invoking the need for miricles. and so evolution and the mechanics of such and the beginnings of life continue in this same style. not just believing but searching for understanding too.and changing / adapting the theory ("belief") of evolution towards that which is true.

back to whether anyone is out there.
I would be suprised if no other life existed anywhere else in the universe but I do doubt whether it is charging around the galaxy and kidnapping people from texas.

to summarise , life of some type yes. intelligent starwars-esk life rather unlikely but certainly not impossible (we being proof of intelligent life at least)

The thing is that that .016 (or whatever it is) chance of finding life is the chance of finding life at one star. And there is an enourmous amount of stars out there might even be an infinite amount of them. And let's say that the chance of finding life is .016 there is life at every 160th star. And if the number of stars is infinite there should be an infinite amount of life in the universe.
But the chance of being able to contact them might not be very good though, but that not what's it about if you ask if there is life out there.

Hello Researcher 207128,

I was telling someone almost the same thing just recently. (I'm not sure that the number of stars are infinite though). I also mentioned that if all the stars and galaxies were creating using much the same process, and the same elements, it is highly likely that, if stars and planets were created elsewhere, life was created elsewhere as well.

(What a long sentence, hope that makes sense.)

By the way, if you put an introduction on your space (even just a short one) one of the ACEs will pop by and tell you about all the wonders of h2g2.

it was J S Haldane -i think-who said that not only is the universe queerer than we imagine but queerer than we CAN imagine. what makes "us" think we know it all? somebody else (?) said "i don't understand the universe its bigger than i am." and maybe some of the very nicest people are aliens!!!

cheers hopefully

Why do you find it so hard to believe? When the most conservative scientists are calling for exploration of mars and jupiter. We've never explored further than our solar system, which may be one of many within our galaxy, let alone the millions of other galaxies that have been sighted.

Besides, life on other planets may not be at the same stage of evolution- we may be talking about bacteria - reptiles, even dinosaurs! How cool would that be?

Sorry, off on a tangent there! While I'm here, does anyone have any words I can use to replace the word cool?

How about 'Ace'?

'Ace'...like that!

On the whole 'does anything exist' scale, everything around us is mainly space. If u look at the electron model of stuff (was trying to sound proffessional, but given up now!) its shape is made by electrons whizzing around a central nucleus of protons and neutrons. If u magnify it trillions of times, all you'll see is space! We are standing on space. I am typing on space... ok, I guess u get the picture!

Sorry, I just think its mental!

Also, while I'm here, impossible task for you all over christmas. Think of a colour. No, a brand new colour that no-ones invented yet. Now describe it to me...

C u later - merry christmas!
Kirp xXx

Okay, imagine your eyes are closed. (No, don't actually close them, or you won't be able to read the rest of this.) You know all those colours you can see swimming about when your eyes are closed, well, it's none of the obvious ones you can put a name to, it's one in between. You have to look very hard, move through the bright spots of blue, red and green, it's in the darker areas. It's not black, but it's dark. It maybe the actual colour of anti-matter.

Alright, it's post-Christmas/New Year, and I'm not entirely sane.

Its ok, sanity is optional! Thats my philosophy anyway. And I'll stick by it!

Its my excuse, whats yours?
Kirp