h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I work shifts and that was one of those stories that I mostly missed.

Yeah right, and the dog ate your home work suuuuure. Now come on you can access any information you want 24/7 if you look properly.

OK enough nit picking. Some serious questions your post raises.

When was gun ownership ever realtively high in the UK? Relative to now, to other countries, to membership of the Austrian Navy, relative to what exactly?

India is the worlds largest democracy did it acheive its independence from the British Empire by using guns? (hint the answer is on the Indian flag)

Which regimes dont fear the people? Yours does, but rather than create a stink or upset wealthy arms makers it simply pays those arms makers more public money that could go on useful things to make them better armed than the people. Is that a good thing?

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"So you are saying it is better to be 6 times more likely to be mugged than 10-30 times more likely to be shot dead?"

Well there was another survey of crime which showed that 25% of the population of England and Wales reported that they were victims of crime which was much higher than the states. Murder in the states really does follow distinct geographic and demographic lines. I lived in NYC for years (never felt the need to carry a gun, never had one) and could point out the areas on the map where most of the murders occur. If you avoid these areas then you are quite safe, and the murder rate outside these areas is quite low. And outside NYC rates plummet even further.

I think the large crime rate in England affects more people than you believe and that the overall quality of life of people is affected more in England than in America. One example: Some work colleagues who were over in Dublin said how much they preferred Dublin because they felt that they couldn't relax in Bristol and that they always felt 'vibes' and were uneasy when having a few pints. They told us horror stories of random beatings outside pubs etc. I thought this was bizarre because Dublin is hardly the safest place in the world! However, what is important here is not the actual fact of the real crime rates in Dublin and Bristol but *their* perception of going out in Bristol. They felt real fear when out in Bristol and rarely went out at night. Despite how Bristol really is, their quality of life had really suffered.

I am unlikely ever to be murdered (if I stay outside the dodgy areas, I am far more likely to win the lottery). But in England a mugging or a beating seems to be not just unlikely but with 25% affected, it seems damn near inevitable.

I know which scenario I prefer.

Interestingly, a colleague i worked with in NYC was sent by his job to a county in (I think) South Dakota. The local law there was that EVERY male over a certain age (23 I think) carry a loaded firearm at all times in full public view. He said it was weird to see everyone walking about with holstered guns just like a western. When asked what it was like there, he reported that the people were very, very polite. Crime was unknown.

One reaction in NYC to the draconian gun laws there are a 'jury backlash'. Juries are beginning to simply refuse to convict anyone of defending themselves with a firearm, even if it was illegally held.

"Yeah right, and the dog ate your home work suuuuure." Honestly, I was only fairly sure the guy involved was a farmer!

Gun ownership was relatively high up to 1920 when the first gunownership laws were brought in. (That I am aware of anyway).

"India is the worlds largest democracy did it acheive its independence from the British Empire by using guns?" Would that have worked against other colonial powers? I think not.

"Which regimes dont fear the people? Yours does" I think you are making some assumptions about where I live... Though you are inadvertantly right. Mine DOES. Bigtime. The Republic of Ireland does not like ANYONE having guns (except the regime of course) and have been extraordinarily paranoid about it. I DO find it strange that you ask such a question. Why should a democracy fear the people? Very strange.

Well most violent crimes take place in the home, but as on average it takes the women who are the main victims being attacked 33, thats thirty three times, before they go to the police we really cant draw an awful lot from such figures.

If I was punched by some drunk in a pub I wouldnt report it to the police, unless it was a police officer who hit me.

Crime figures are very spurious and realy depend a lot on the outlook of the victim and even the reporting mechanism.

Gun ownership was relatively high up to 1920 when the first gunownership laws were brought in. (That I am aware of anyway).

Im not even going to look for figures for back then, but do you really think that expensive as guns and other consumer items were back then that owner ship in Britain pre-1920 would come anywhere near the USA's today.

Yeah Bristol can be fairly scary, never been to Dublin but I think your colleuages perceptions were just that their perceptions. I saw a guy get killed ooutside my local a fornight later I was inside when a woman got her eye socket and half her skull caved in. I fyou had heard of these things would you have gone in there. I used the place for years after and never had many problems, no more than anywhere else.

But what has this got to do tih guns? Fear of crime is a big motivation to our reactions and if those same people were out in Bristol and armed they would be more twitchy, than in a similar situation in Dublin. Having a gun and being more likely to use it unecessarily are undividable facts.


"India is the worlds largest democracy did it acheive its independence from the British Empire by using guns?" Would that have worked against other colonial powers? I think not.

Well you can extemporise about the actions of other Empires all you like the facts speak for themselves dont they!


You mentioned the fact that no true democracy needs to disarm its citizens. No true democracy would need to infringe civil liberties, assembly would not be constrained by law, there would be no censorship, there'd be no secret services. Fact is that as well as being open to abuse by governemts these things help maintain stability and peace. Peace is not just a phssical thing its a mental state and if guns were legal here Id feel a lot less peaceful.

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