h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Okay, so I will look it up or ask my Mongolian teacher then.

Methos

In the meantime I've done a bit of searching in a wondeful book called "Sign, Symbol and Script," which covers every written language there's ever been. It seems that Mongolian is a part of the Turkic-Uigurian group. But its scripts were developed initially by Tibetan monks, and only very recently was the basic script changed to a Cyrillic form by the Soviets.

Tibetan is part of the Burmo-turkic group, so the language is quite different, and the formal script is derived from the Bengali form of Sanskrit Devanagari.

So it's still likely that the word "lam" for monk in Mongolian is a loan-word from Tibetan, After all, the Mongolians had no use for monks until they took up Tibetan Buddhism. They were far too busy charging about conquering, looting and pillaging.

Excuse me but like I already said I do study Mongolian studies at university including history and everything else. And the Mongolians were no more into "conquering, looting and pillaging" than the rest of the world. Remember the crusades taking place at the same time? And the mongolians for their part were very tolerant concerning religions.

Also, although the majority of the Mongolians became buddhists only in the 16th century, that doesn't mean the didn't have a religion before that. They were shamanists.

And the classical Mongolian script was not developed by buddhist monks but loaned from the Uigurs. The second Mongolian script was developed by a buddhist monk.

Having said that I still think it's possible that the word "lam" derives from a Tibetan or Indian word. I will ask my teacher on Saturday.

Methos

My dear Methos,

Er, did you take me that seriously? I have not the slightest gripe against the Mongols, and no wish to slander them in any way. Nor was I passing any moral judgements. Not am I in any way devaluing your University studies. But, when I studied medieval European history, which included the incredibly corrupt financial politicking behind the crusades, the "Mongol hordes," like it or leave it, were the most feared army in the world, and swept across Asia, right up to the doors of Venice, with a reputation for bloodletting second to none.

And as for the derivation of their alphabets, I quote from an authoritative source, merely offering the info for what it is worth.

So let's keep it light, OK?

Okay, so I admit, I may have overreacted a bit...

It's just that it so annoys me that all people know about Mongolia and its people that there was this Cingis khan, a bloodthirsty killer who is often named right in line with Hitler. Argh!!! In the middleages the cultures in Europe were not very "nice" either. And of course, people in Europe at that time were afraid of the Mongolians. If it weren't for the fact that their khaan (king) died, Germany would have probably been conquered, too.

My yeah, I will ask my teacher tomorrow.

Methos

You were right. I asked my teacher and she confirmed that the Mongolian word "lam" derives from the Tibetan word "bhla-ma" which does mean teacher.

Methos

Thanks, As I thought. One shouldn't be confused by the Tibetan spelling, because there are so many unpronounced consonantal modifiers, in this instance the initial "b" ( I've never seen it spelled with a "bh" before! )

In that Tibetan is quite like Irish. The area near where I live is spelt Dun Laoghaire. The first word is pronounced as spelt,"doon," but the second is pronounced..go on...have a guess......















Laoghaire = Leery

I couldn't have guessed that ever. Geez.

If you know Tibetan yourself, just ignore the following.

But concerning the "bh" in bhla-ma - I looked it up in a Tibetan dictionary and it is written "bla-ma" but since there are three consonants which express versions of p/b it's all about how you transcribe it. The "l" is subscribed by the way.

Methos