A Conversation for Advanced Driving Techniques
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Dreaduk Started conversation Oct 12, 2009
I'm interested in the qualifications of the individual who posted this advanced driving nonsense.
outstretched arms are dangerous and reduce steering control as we need leverage to steer a car which is impossible unless arms are slightly bent at the elbows. Keeping your self further back from the steering wheel is fanciful rubbish.
Noah used double de-clutching when he was sailing the Ark, since then synchromesh has been invented and it is now counter-productive to do it unless you are driving a (very) classic car.
I find one of your respondents utterly irresponsible suggesting safety on the road is secondary to anything, everything we do as drivers should be dictated by safety.
What on earth are you talking about when you discuss adjusting mirrors! They should be adjusted with a view down the side of the vehicle in order that your mind has a perspective from which to judge distances from. You should be checking your mirrors frequently enough to ensure you understand precisely what is happening behind you at all times. As for looking over your right shoulder before changing lanes, more dangerous rubbish, you should be aware what is behind you at all times and therefore no swerve inducing head turn is necessary. This is also true of motorcycles as promoted by many Police Motorcyclists.
On the approach to corners, the corner should be assessed and hedges and telegraph poles etc. can be used as guidelines but they frequently disappear into the middle of fields so they must be used with supporting information and extreme caution. Of course the engines deceleration should be used in preference to braking but there is nothing wrong with braking if you are going too quickly.
As for braking mid corner,many people, including 'advanced' drivers make misjudgements therefore there is nothing wrong with it. If you are driving fast enough that using the brakes will affect traction you are going too fast as you have not allowed for the unexpected and therefore the possibility of needing to use the brakes.
I can't believe the author of this article describing 'positioning' without qualifying it by advising what to do if there are oncoming vehicles on a left hand bend; one should revert to the safety position i.e. the centre of the road, away from the oncoming vehicles as by doing so you are better able to see any oncoming cars starting to overtake and you are not perceived as intimidating or challenging.
And what driving organisation taught you to "pump the brakes" (cadence braking)a skilled technique that a practised driver can use to stop a car safely and quickly. For those unfamiliar with the technique, under braking, when the limits of traction are reached the wheels lock, the driver releases the brake and reapplies pressure to maintain rolling resistance but continually reaching the limits of adhesion. It is a difficult and unreliable method for anyone but the most skilled driver to use as few of us recognise when the limits of adhesion are reached and are practised enough to pump the pedal quickly enough for it to have a meaningful effect.
Driving in as high a gear as possible is not conducive to fuel saving indeed it is counter-productive as if I drive a modern car at 30mph in 5th gear I will be able to keep moving but at the cost of engine longevity and probably fuel consumption. Furthermore, you should be in the correct gear for the conditions and the speed of the vehicle. The car should be able to accelerate briskly if required and engine braking effectively slows the vehicle thereby reducing braking and saving fuel.
Quite what advanced driving organisation teaches people to drive a car without a clutch is beyond me. Any advanced organisation I have encountered would say 'get your clutch fixed before you drive the car' promoting anything else is dangerous.
I despair at your 'advice' for jump starting a car. Firstly consult the owners manual for advice specific to your car on the subject before attempting a jump start. Thereafter you make no mention of the battery terminals of the donor car being disconnected; simply attaching to an earthed bit of bodywork is not enough, paint will affect the grounding. It's bad enough risking the delicate electronic components of the target car by jump starting far less those of the doners car as well. It is far better practise to connect up the leads to the target cars disconnected battery and leave the donor car running for ten minutes in order to provide a small charge to the battery then reconnect and try starting. If that doesn't work, disconnect the doner cars battery and connect the leads directly to the batteries terminals of it and the now reconnected target car and make several short attempts of no more than 10 seconds to start the vehicle with a gap of at least 30 seconds between each to avoid overheating batteries and leads. If your leads start smoking it is probably nothing to do with a 'dead short' (which would probably manifest itself as a melting battery) but that you are trying to draw too much current through inadequate leads and had you been allowing 30 seconds between 10 second bursts you shouldn't encounter the problem.
Finally, the single most important safe driving technique in the Highway Code is the term "Drive at a speed that will allow you to stop well within the distance you can see to be clear" no matter the circumstances this is the single most important default to safety drivers have.
Amateur, uninformed drivers like you dispensing advice are a dangerous liability. Internet forums are the only means you have of publishing your ill informed ideas on driving but unfortunately there are people who will listen without questioning.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
I was the main author of this entry and I am indeed an "amateur" driver, but some of the techniques were contributed by a researcher who was a professional taxi driver and had attended an advanced driving course. Other techniques, such as looking over your shoulder before changing lanes, are reommended by the Rules of the Road.
>>What on earth are you talking about when you discuss adjusting mirrors?
If you don't understand what I'm talking about, why do you contradict it? And it is clear you do not understand, as the method of aligning the mirrors you recommend creates a blind spot. I agree you should be checking the mirrors constantly, but anything that increases the chances of you seeing a car coming up beside you is a help. The method of positioning the mirrors in the this entry eliminates the blind spot, so it makes your driving safer.
My advice for jump-starting cars has been used many times, and is the one recommended by most manuals.
It is self-evident that if there are cars coming the other way, the advise for positioning does not apply. You don't need to tell people not to drive straight into an oncoming car.
The advice about outstretched arms was to avoid people being so close to the steering wheel as to almost touch it. I wasn't recommending you drive with your elbows locked! Of course you'll have a bend on your elbows.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
Since a lot of people misinterpret what I wrote about driving with outstretched arms, I think I'll have to reword it slightly.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
I've reworded the "outstretched arms" slightly, and added a paragraph about driving in a high gear if you are travelling long distances at constant speed.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
Here's a quote from the Rules of the Road about changing lanes:
"If you have good reason to change lanes, use your mirrors and check in plenty of time to ensure that the way is clear. To check your blind spot when travelling at speed, take a quick sideways glance to check the position of a vehicle that may have disappeared from your view in the mirror. "
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
goodbillydontlift Posted Oct 12, 2009
Forget your 'Rules of the road' nonsense, if you were just going to echo whats written in that then you have no right in calling the article 'Advanced Driving Techniques'. Some of your techniques are wrong and could be dangerous to Mr Average Joe Bloggs who does not know how to complete them safetly. Whilst i'm sure the article was written with the best of intentions, trying to teach someone by text alone to Heel and Toe, can be horrifically dangerous. To then tell us the article was contributed by a TAXI driver just makes this whole thing laughable.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
So if the information is not in the Rules of the Road, it is "dangerous rubbish" while if it is in the Rules of the Road, it is "nonsense" and "not advanced". I can't win!
Everyone thinks they're an expert. If anyone comes up with some sensible suggestions which are not a mixture of rant and factual inaccuracy, I'll consider adding them to the entry,
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
goodbillydontlift Posted Oct 12, 2009
In addition, the whole piece on 'double de-clutching' is totally out of context and is not directly comparable to heal and toe. Double de-clutching was developed for cars without syncromesh to match the gears to engine & wheel speed. For the average driver who struggle to perform normal gear changes this posses such a huge risk to other road users and I would strongly advise anyone who is considering trying this out to do so off the public roads.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
So how would you suggest changing down from 5th to 3rd?
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
goodbillydontlift Posted Oct 12, 2009
I have never experienced any difficulty block changing single clutching.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
rwgray Posted Oct 12, 2009
"So how would you suggest changing down from 5th to 3rd?"
I've never encountered a situation in which I needed to do this intentionally.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
Yet such a situation is described in the Entry, and it is for this situation that double declutching is suggested.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
nickgregory Posted Oct 12, 2009
I would suggest that the author of Advanced Driving Techniques is totally irresponsible in suggesting the car driving techniques he has put forward.Police drivers spend 3 weeks learning how to position their vehicle in relationshipTo hazards, so to suggest to the general public that fixed positioning should be used In positioning at bends without regard to other traffic and the prevailing conditions is
frankly dangerous. There are so many flaws in the advice he offers, he was eitherjoking or speaking from a point of pure ignorance. The criticism offered by the writer saying that his advice was dangerous I fully concur. As I have instructed professionally
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
nickgregory Posted Oct 12, 2009
To change down from 5th to 3rd: bring the speed of the vehicle down to that within the 3rd gear range by deaccelerating or braking then change.Or if within the range when changing down fromm 5th to third increasee the engine speed whilst making the change as shown in the Driving manual which can be borrowed from the local library.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 12, 2009
I'd say the situation here is that you lot know more about this than I do, but you're totally incapable of putting coherent thoughts into text.
Concentrate on what you're writing, please. Advising people to go and look up a book in the local library does not help the reader. Telling people it is nonsense because it is in the rules of the road does not help. Describing a technique recognised by the road safety authorities as advisable for reasons of safety as "dangerous rubbish" does not help.
What would help would be some explanations, clearly described without ranting.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
nickgregory Posted Oct 12, 2009
In the first instance do you agree with my explanation of changing
down from 5th to 3rd?
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
ObserverinMonmouth Posted Oct 12, 2009
Wow, some heated exchanges on this topic but then everyone thinks they are a good driver, me included, and therein lies the problem!
I have been driving for 45 years and have held a racing licence since 1984. I have raced numerous cars from Minis to a ground effect Tyrrell F1 car to good effect having won numerous races and championships. So I reckon I know a bit about driving and car control and I think therefore that I am at least a little bit qualified to comment.
I think a number of the suggestions in the article are well intentioned but some of the techniques mentioned are difficult to learn and implement and should therefore not be practised on the road.
The KEY issue for safe road driving whatever speed one is travelling is that one should never be in a position where one cannot slow down safely assuming the person coming toward you makes a mistake i.e. is travelling too fast and or is badly positioned on the road. If everyone adopts the simple rule of keeping speed down and staying tight to the outside of a right hander and in the crown of the road for a left hander (but ready to change direction) then many accidents would be avoided.
If you want to learn advanced driving techniques then read whatever you like (be it web based or books) BUT go to an appropriate driving school to put it into practice.
That way you will develop into a good driver!
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Gnomon - time to move on Posted Oct 13, 2009
Good advice.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
Not-so-bald-eagle Posted Oct 13, 2009
>>>>"If you want to learn advanced driving techniques then read whatever you like (be it web based or books) BUT go to an appropriate driving school to put it into practice."
I suggest that the above comment be added to the entry.
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
nickgregory Posted Oct 13, 2009
glad to see you have been removed from the front page now only forum members can read your misleading methods of car control.Also you didnt respond to my info about changing from 5th to 3rd.
Key: Complain about this post
Most dangerous lot of nonsense I have ever read!
- 1: Dreaduk (Oct 12, 2009)
- 2: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 3: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 4: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 5: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 6: goodbillydontlift (Oct 12, 2009)
- 7: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 8: goodbillydontlift (Oct 12, 2009)
- 9: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 10: goodbillydontlift (Oct 12, 2009)
- 11: rwgray (Oct 12, 2009)
- 12: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 13: nickgregory (Oct 12, 2009)
- 14: nickgregory (Oct 12, 2009)
- 15: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 12, 2009)
- 16: nickgregory (Oct 12, 2009)
- 17: ObserverinMonmouth (Oct 12, 2009)
- 18: Gnomon - time to move on (Oct 13, 2009)
- 19: Not-so-bald-eagle (Oct 13, 2009)
- 20: nickgregory (Oct 13, 2009)
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