h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Afternoon rg

Delayed lunch break (sandwich at desk)

LCT: Sorry should have written LC(T) - Landing Craft (Tank). The big jobs with the slab fronted droppable bows. On the ferries (presumably war surplus) these were welded shut but their performance in any kind of rough weather made for an unpleasant trip.

Cat attack. The current one only attacks rabbits though we once had one that would attack almost anything except oddly the SO and I.

Hi-tech rickshaws: I must confess I have never actually ridden in one but I agree driving one would make you fit - legwise at least

Militarised moke: Much the same picture/reaction as I had. Titchy ATVs seem to have been a bit of a thing with Issigonis -he also designed the Nuffield Guppy and the Austin Ant. I can find no pictures of either.

Vitara: You could be right I think I was in one once (the he SOs sister used to work for a 'trade' mag and had one to test) but it didn't make much of an impression. We have a 1993 Land Rover Defender 110 station wagon (lovingly maintained) which I was informed was 'not very agile' - hence original quad bike plan.

Weather. I thought I heard on the radio that you had very bad weather down your way. The wind in Hamburgs can be quite bad in winter when you get an easterly of the Russian steppes but its rarely damp in winter -too cold.

Hills: I think there is one but its not very high

Cameron Interchangeability: Are any of them interchangeable. He seems quite popular amongst the usual suspects on the 'What would Cameron have to do.....' thread. My answer, which I can't be bothered to post, would be to give up politics.

I believe the boy has now announced that he has failed to take the P&J element of politics

Frankie the Architect: He may have rumbled that he has been conned as he has announced that if Skippy fails to deliver he will do something.

Lying: I suppose my tolerance is low. I cope using the Paxman mantra as far as politicians are concerned.

Pessimism: I don't see Trevor as pessimist more as a disappointed optimist. I was thinking of the old saw that pessimist is happier than an optimist because he rarely expects a good outcome and but is happy when one occurs whereas the optimist usually expects one and frequently unhappy when it doesn't.

Many cars: Might be affected by the passing of peak oil and the consequential fuel crunch. Pessimistically, as the Scottish bloke in Dad's Army said, 'We're all doooomed'.

Sucked in: Mostly I have not been- not even as far as my new found hobby of poking Clintist is concerned. I only got involved in one thread on the Science Board trying to answer a question of blue_icthus02 about chemical bonding of DNA. Spent last night listening to music and catching up on an ever extending reading list.

must

bs

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'Afternoon Bx4

Thank you for clarifying what a LC(T) was. I had thought this was a type of rail wagon adapted to carry motor vehicles on the Forth Rail Bridge. I can well imagine that the amphibious LC(T) would have given a stomach churning ride. Issigonis designed two popular cars from my youth; the Mini and the 1100. There was also something called a "land crab" which was an 1100 on steroids. http://www.landcrab.net/ I never saw any of the military vehicles in the flesh (or in pictures till you posted the link to the Moke the other day).

I did have a couple of Land Rovers as "company cars" in my distant past. My favourite was a V8 which was shelved long before "four star" reached a fiver a gallon. You are right about the bad (wet) weather; in contrast it's been sunny today. I've posted the odd plug for my referendum without success on the Lib Dem/ Tory/ Labour threads. I notice that Gordon Brown has got into the P&J spirit by calling Cameron a "shallow salesman". He must have been listening to PM yesterday afternoon. Frank has been quiet since his triumph in winning a promise out of Brown. We were all "promised" something once…

The pessimist/ optimist analysis – I can see the logic in it. My evenings also peppered with reading (the Dresden book has the RAF visiting Leipzig which it says is within 60 miles of its ultimate target) and the occasional R4 programme like the one about BAA. From a business point of view if Heathrow is at over capacity; BAA might want to review the cost effectiveness of its investment plans. Perhaps they have and they're not saying.

MDT

Evening rg

Ferries and bridges. it quite odd what turns up when you start googling. I vaguely remember the converted LCTs and the pre-road bridge Queensferry ferries but it turns out there is a whole back story (including the worlds first RORO train ferry)

http://www.edinphoto.org.uk/0_a/0_around_edinburgh_-_firth_of_forth_-_ferry_boats_queensferry.htm
http://www.edinphoto.org.uk/0_a/0_around_edinburgh_-_firth_of_forth_-_ferry_boats_granton.htm

Roro trains: Sadly not ferry or Kincardine bridge/

Militarised mokes: must confess I did not know they existed either till I found the link.

I found a picture of the Austin Ant but it is quite dull compared to the military moke. No picture of Nuffield Guppy which is a shame given the description:

'The vehicle was designed to be parachute-droppable and was intended to assist paratroops to transport loads up to 500 lb at walking speeds and to be amphibious. The vehicle somewhat resembles the DUKW but was only about 8 feet long. It had large balloon tyres and an outboard motor at the rear. It was capable of carrying one person with equipment - or being used as a kind of motorized wheelbarrow by someone walking alongside the vehicle. The war in Europe ended before the Guppy saw service.'


The Surrey Moke: Apparently a conversion by a company called Crayford. Only the 20 built -19 for export. The other was *the* taxi.

Landrover V8: I seem to recall that was a petrol job, ours is diesel. I am not sure why we have a Landrover though they are very common on the Island.

The Landcrab: Thanks for the link. As you know I am a bit vague about four wheelers. Were all three types called the 'Landcrab' and why?

I see the 1800 competed against the Citroen DS which is what we had after ragtop 1. Picked by the SO who was very excited about it as I recall but I mostly remember it as being warm and very, very comfortable.

Cameron/Brown. I am not sure there was much convincing evidence that P&J ever died out. It will be interesting to see if the 'salesman' jibe is developed further in the spirit of the 'ditherer' one.

My grasp ofwhat is going on at the moment in offshore Ruritania is a bit erratic but I am sure I have heard:

Frank the Architect: Definitely threatening Gordy with unspecified sanctions if he doesn't deliver.

The Evil that is Skippy: Reported as admitting he made a mistake over the 10p tax.

Dave the Potato Head: Something about if the Skippies do well in the local elections then Gordy may go to the country early.

Either this means he doesn't expect the NTs to do well or its a cunning plan to get people to vote for Gordy in the hope that he will hold an early general election.

BAA: I heard the programme. I wonder if it's Heathrow specific. We mostly fly out through Glasgow or sometimes Edinburgh. Both are BAA but they don't seem to have the same problems as Heathrow.

I must confess that I am fairly indifferent to the travails of the inhabitants of Strelsau and its environs. I hope Boris is their next king.

Must go. Can't be bothered cooking for one so I am off to a local eatery who reputedly do a very good labskaus.

bs

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'Morning Bx4

I enjoyed looking at the ferry links thank you. The Nuffield Guppy specification reads years ahead of its time. Imagine thousands of paratroops landing, getting onto their personal motorised transport and away to battle with the startled enemy. I was sorry to read that there was only one 'taxi' in the village. Perhaps there wasn't much demand? The Land Rover V8 was petrol. The current model is diesel and starts off at GBP20000 or so. Lucky I didn't have to foot the bill. These days there is also the increased road fund licence to think about if the vehicle dates after March 1, 2001 (a recent budget change). I don't know where the name land crab came from though I remember it being used a lot in the press. I can only think the wheel at each corner configuration gave a crab like stability (crabs being flat and having limbs at each corner). I don't know. Of course a vehicle can crab because its chassis is bent after an accident in which case it is surely a bad thing. I never drove a DS though I'm sure it was superb if its successor XM was a guide. The latter was remarkable. It was a triumph of eccentric engineering.

On Today "Yesterday in Parliament" more of the PMQ was played; as well as the 'shallow salesman' jibe Brown recalled the 'bicycle followed by the chauffeur' taunt and even had a go at Nick Clegg. If Cameron has any ambition to be PM he needs to stop giving Brown ammunition. Luckily from the Tory's point of view they can quietly drop Cameron after the next General Election. There would be nothing unusual about this as this has happened regularly since 1997. I won't shed any tears. I don't have a feel about today's local elections so will await the result before speculating on Gordon Brown going to the country. Today suggested that the economic situation was going to get better so maybe it's best to see the good times role before thinking that local results translate into national trends. A snap election would kill the referendum. The debate in the Lords is ongoing pending an immediate dissolution.

The BAA programme did concentrate on the London airports. Hope the labskaus was good. My relative in Munich has been hospitalised with a blood disorder. Whilst I was sad to hear this news I suspect the fact that she smokes like a chimney couldn't have helped. Of blood one of the comments attributed to Gordon Brown yesterday was 'The prime minister said it was a "settled view of the public" that fox-hunting should be banned and that no bill should be moved for its reinstatement'. Maybe true though how does he know what the "settled view of the public" is about anything? Perhaps Cameron should taunt him with a 'mystic son of manse' tag.

MDT

Evening rg:

The Guppy: I could cope with the the notion that it was as a mini-DUKW till I read the bit about it being steered like a wheelbarrow. I thought I had found a picture but it turned out to be a DUKW but it did lead me to the London tour DUKW

http://www.answers.com/topic/dukw?cat=technology

IMO, apart from its amphibious nature I doubt it would have given the Kettenrad much competition.

The Taxi Moke: I must confess I was surprised to discover there was only one taxi. Hardly worth bothering with the licence plate.

Citroen XM: I looked it up and it is apparently the successor to last 'real Citroen' the CX but both look quite conventional when compared with the DS

Landrover V8: Misread it at first and thought you meant that somebody had punted for a shiny new one for you in 2001.

Landcrab: As with the Guppy image -I can find no explanation of the name. Something to do with the 'hydrolastic' suspension perhaps?

Cameron/Brown P & J: Strangely I saw the clip on a feed. the Potato Head look quite unhappy with Gordy's response. I presume it wasn't anticipated

Replacing Dave: You could be right th- I looked up his bio on wiki and if don't you think the hair looks a bit fake. He may be Baldy Man III.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Davidcameron.jpg

Big Event in Ruritania: I thought you got suppressed if you mentioned it . Well done for slipping it in.

That referendum: I don't see that it would be scuppered by a sap General Election. Surely it would depend on who won.

Labskaus: Completely a no-no health wise but delicious. Light meal at home tonight to compensate.

Munich relative: Hope its not too serious.

Shootin, huntin' and fishin': google' Two Stags Dave and ianbone for a brilliant picture of Dave. Quite impressive skill for a man with no hands.

Mystic: not an epithet that app;ies to serious presbyterians. Anyhow Dave is a 'son of the market'

Here is a picture of another of his ancestors:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:William.IV.of.Great.Britain.JPG

Note the ........potato head.

I turned up this on his bio:

'Through his father, he was then employed for a further three months in Hong Kong by Jardine Matheson as a 'ship jumper', an administrative post for which no experience was needed but which gave him some experience of work'

Obviously well suited for politics.

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'Morning Bx4

"Deputy leader Vince Cable said: "The important thing is that we've beaten Labour into third place." http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7372860.stm

CON 147 1977 8 45
LAB -162 1573 -6 14
LD 9 1086 -1 6

I can tell you still hanker for a Kettenrad. Moving up to date there is such a thing as a "Gator" http://www.carpassion.com/en/forum/others/1788-john-deere-gator-hpx.html which I have tried out. No heritage value. It appears to be useful and relatively inexpensive as compared to other big boys' toys. I'd forgotten all about the CX. I drove an estate version once. It had a clutchless gear change and the non self cancelling indicator switch was on top of the instrument binnacle. Landcrab name: I don't think it was the hydrolastic suspension as the Mini and 1100 series both had it (though the Mini reverted back to rubber cones).

I didn't see Cameron's reaction, he may have been unhappy though he shouldn't have been surprised. I have written before that I think the Q&A sessions in both houses should be stopped. They are a complete waste of time. There is nothing wrong with being bald. I'm surprised you think the referendum could be revived depending on who won a snap election. This is because I was under the impression that you thought the Conservatives were paper tigers who wouldn't say boo to the EU goose. The Big Event which I read as Local Elections was an opinion poll. There is no real local power in the UK. The purse strings and rules are all set centrally (contrary to my understanding of the principle of subsidiarity). It's beyond me how anyone can project anything nationally from local results.

I too hope that Munich relative is better soon (thank you) and I shall make further enquiries tonight. I am a wee bit concerned about your obsession with David Cameron. He is an opposition MP for an Oxfordshire constituency. With or without dithering he can't effect a decision that could possibly affect you. Remember oppositions don't win elections, governments lose. I'm not sure where the 'Real Opposition' is going other than back to their traditional role of nestling up to Labour like a forlorn puppy.

I'm trying to think whether evidence that a kettle worked before is proof that it will work again. Does it make any difference if it is a one time event? Also whilst you may seek evidence; why should you expect someone else to? People are not all as rational as you, Trevor thinks this is why the referendum can't be held, and people wouldn't use their heads. What is a 'ship jumper' and is there a career path?

MDT

Afternoon rg

Thanks for the results. Is Boris King of Strelsa?

Vince Cable: Are the Cleggies now the real 'real opposition'?.

The CX: I didn't know it existed till you mentioned it. Still think CS was the coolest looking.

The landcrab; Shame about the 'hydrolastic' suspension - I thought it might be something to with the way the genuine articles legs hold the body above the ground. Ah well.

The Deere 'Gator': Thanks for the link. They are available in the UK the cheapest at 4K is also called the CX. They look suspiciously like quad bikes so I will conceal them from the SO.

There is even a militarised version the M-gator which is successfully serving with the US marines: (picture here):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Deere_Gator

Deere clearly have a better idea of what is needed in an ATV than Issigonis.

In continuing saga of animal themed vehicles (mokes, ants, guppies.....) Deere bought the German company Lanz who manufactured the Bulldog:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lanz_Bulldog

Kettenrad. You may be confusing this with the R75 Luftwaffe combo. The Kettenrad does not seem a very practical option though it seems quite good as an ATV.
http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2006/01/13/kettenkrad-the-motorcycle-tank/

Cameron obsession. Think Bambi. Utterly phony and theoretically a future PM. I find it strange that anyone would actually vote for either.

That referendum: Generally with VC's view of the Potatos- 'in opposition anti, in government pro' and they have never held a referendum on any EU treaty. But this time they have painted themselves into a bit of a corner........

Kettles: Proof in science is never absolute. However, I am not aware of any prior occurence where, under STP conditions, if sufficient heat is applied for sufficient time to a kettle, then the water has not boiled.

One time event: It's not though - everybody dies.

Evidence. If people claim to 'know' something then it does not seem unreasonable to ask the basis on which they have arrived at this knowledge. Knowledge and belief are different

Rational. I don't think I am particularly so. I think the leap of faith is a valid response to the existential predicament though not one I would choose to make because I don't feel the need.

Ship jumper: There are a couple of definitions on the web but none that seem to relate to working at Jardine Matheson

Career path: Presumably not since he wants to be PM. Another job requiring no experience or any requirement of competence.

bs

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Hi Bx4

I'm sorry I misled you with my kettle analogy. I was thinking about the electric type with an electricity supply, fuse and element to fail. I thought death (as opposed to near death) was a "one time" occurrence? Certainly from the participant's point of view it is. I agree that knowledge and belief are different. I quickly lost interest in the death thread. It seems to me that people can believe what they like. It makes no difference because in the end whatever we think whatever happens; it happens regardless of belief. (No I have no evidence or proof therefore it's a dead end – boom boom).

It's interesting what you say about Cameron's qualifications. There is one difference between him and Brown; the latter wasn't elected, not even his own party was given its say. I have complained about this without success. I thought from the beginning this was simply asking for trouble. No wonder the real opposition made the "Stalin to Mr Bean" connection. As you know I think oppositions should always oppose, contradictions are irrelevant. All bets are off when a new manifesto is published. So if the Tories think a referendum is a vote loser they'll drop it like a stone. The point for me is that the 2005 Labour manifesto is still active and only Labour could deliver in the HoC. The picture is different in the Lords when the real opposition could lance Labour in support of their own manifesto commitment.

I had a look at all the Gator and 'semi-diesel' links. As you say maybe the Gator is too much of a quad. Though I know one farming couple who have one and they are not quad people at all; far too respectable for that wild 'banana splits" high jinx.

MDT

'Evening Bx4

PS

"...Linux Format ... Ubuntu based version of the OS..."

I bought the June 2008 edition today and have started playing. Thanks again for the tip.

BSY

PPS

*jinx*

I've just re read this and I realise I shouldn't have posted after that Rioja. What a mess. My apologies. Enjoy your weekend. We have a Bank Holiday on Monday.

MDT

Morning rg

rioja: Shame on you! Remember even h2g2 is part of the BBC.

The kettle: No I knew the kettle was electric but my point was that prior experience shows that the kettle will likely boil but that we have no prior experience that would lead one to conclude that death is not the end.

I don't quite see what the slight but admitted statistical likelihood that the kettle will fail to boil has to do with this?

One time occurrence: From the individual viewpoint indeed but the evidence fro many deaths does not lead one to the conclusion that there is an 'after'

belief: I share your view except of course when they attempt to impose them on the rest of us.

knowledge: A different matter: When people claim to 'know' something especially when it relates to the supernatural I am quite intrigued by how this works.

boom boom

The unelected skippy. However even in local and national elections if nobody stands against a candidate then he/she is 'returned unopposed'

Opposition: I agree with you that an opposition should oppose though I am a bit unclear as to why contradictions are irrelevant (a rioja moment?)

However if we are, indeed, in the 'era of the Clones' is the P&J of political theatre, real opposition or pretence?

referendum: However if the LT had not been ratified at the time of the hypothetical 'snap' election then the parties would have new manifestos which might or might no contain promises on an LT referendum.

'real' opposition. They might but they won't

Gator: I take your point about it not being a quad but it is definitely the sort of thing that would attract the SO. Might be better than the 'other shoe'. I am not too bothered really as it has definitely been agreed that boxer 2 is next on list.

The site with the definitive picture of the cross country capabilities of the Kettenrad seems to be dedicated to eccentric burners. I found this Kettenrad replacement on it:

http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2006/01/12/hyanide-and-baal-all-terrain-motorcycles/

as well as tilting 'reverse' trikes

http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2007/06/01/harley-davidson-leaning-trike-patent-application/
tp://thekneeslider.com/archives/2007/11/20/tilting-v-max-trike-by-tilting-motor-works/
http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2007/02/10/can-am-spyder-details/

The latter of course also continues the 'animal' theme

Linux: Does it run from CD or is it installed on your hard drive?

Weekend: I am somewhat in the doghouse. I indulged in a second Labskaus on Friday and let this slip to the SO. Saturday was marked by 'healthy' eating (steamed fish with soy and sesame oil dressing and ginger and garlic broccoli).

Enjoy your Monday off

bs

"…the evidence from many deaths does not lead one to the conclusion that there is an 'after'…" – what evidence? Having said that I agree anyone claiming knowledge about this (either way) is on shaky ground. Are they confusing knowledge with belief? Sorry I lost the plot with unelected Brown. Yes he did stand and no one could find the support (amongst MPs) to stand against him. I don't things are as bad for Labour as all the navel gazing "we must listen" talk of the past week would suggest. I find it odd that Gordon Brown is the only giant amongst hundreds of men (and women). The contradictions; so long as the opposition consistently opposes the government then from my point of view there is no problem. The government proposes and executes policy, there is no need the opposition to support them it even if the latter subsequently adopts the policy in its manifesto. I think we are on the same wavelength about the LTR in new manifestos.

Congratulations on getting Boxer 2 to the top of the list. It is definitely bike weather now. I enjoyed looking at the posted machines (and the Boris stories posted in the London thread). By the way I was stowing some chain oil at the weekend and twigged that ketten meant chain. I decided to splash out on a second disk drive for one of my machines so I can use it as a playground for Linux. For some reason, on the Linux installation, I can't get any sound out of the speakers (plugged into the headphone socket). Monday off was far too short though I did enjoy it (thank you). I'm sure an occasional Labskaus balanced by exercise and an otherwise healthy diet is fine.

MDT

Afternoon

lunchtime on the Christian topic as there are creationists *and* 'Bright's' about. Deep joy!

It has an early bathtime so I'll catch you later.

I am indulging in fantasies about the new 'Kettenrad'

Hope you had a good bank holiday weekend.
bs

Evening rg

evidence?: Evidence that there is an afterlife. There seems to be none that is irrefutable.

either way: Not really - if one asserts a proposition to be true then it is up to the proponent of the proposition to demonstrate its truth.

Propositions like the 'afterlife exists' are unfalsifiable unless the have testable existential predicates.

Losing the plot: I assumed it was the rioja

Brown: All the 'giants' of Nulabour's early years seem to have gone all that seem to be left are youthful 'greasy pole' climbers. I suspect Brown's best strategy is to put some clear blue water between himself and the NuTories. IMO, he lacks the courage.

Opposition: Perhaps, but the Tories have supported NuLabour, foundation hospitals, student loans, increased university fees, city colleges..... I am not sure that the cosmetic opposition of clone parties works for me.

Manifestos:I agree but I doubt if the situation will arise since an election before 2010 seems less likely after the local election results.

Also the interest in the Lisbom Treaty seems to be in decline. It may not be a major issue by 2010.

An amusing story on the SNP's promise in their manifesto of an independence referendum in 2010. Labour has changed its mind.:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7383035.stm

The fragrant Wendy ( who has had her own 'dodgy donations' scandal) wants it *now*.

Alex Salmond says it was promised for 2010 and that promise will be honoured. Wendy threatens to introduce a bill for it to happen *now*.

Given the general hostility created by the 10p fiasco etc., this might not be a wise strategy.

How will the 'real' opposition react.

boxer2: This was agreed when the 'quad' was dropped so no matter what the other shoe - the boxer is assured and the additional per diems, euro exchange rate and predicted profits guarantee its imminent purchase.

I will start looking for a suitable machine on my return. It will be big.

kettenrad: Apparently means literally 'chainwheel'

http://www.classicbikeforum.com/forum8/2809-6.html

From the brief comments on handling I wonder of the 'chainwheel' refers to the tracked wheels rather than a chaindrive?

chain oil: Is that an indication that you are reverting to your first love, chain adjustment, rather than the tedium of kurusting?

I was a a bit surprised at your lack of response to my weird bikes links

Linux: I have one machine with 4 OS installed on two hard drives.

I use multi boot loader to select which OS run. How is yours setup?

Speakers. Why are you using the headphone socket rather than the speaker socket. Have you installed the linux driver for your sound card? This might help:

http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2001/05/17/drivers_1-intro.html

and this on Ubuntu drivers.

http://www.ubuntu.com/partners/hardwareprogramme/freesoftware

You might also get some advice on this Mint forum

http://linuxmint.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=49&sid=167d5fa884dc204478570ef18bec5e31

Labskaus: You may think so- I may think so - but the SO doesn't think so. I anticipate an attempt to give me 'stuff' to do that will involve........ exercise.

The erection of a new polytunnel has been mentioned but I say pah. On Sunday I will ride the burner into the sunrise.

bs

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'Morning Bx4

I think our approach to the 'afterlife exists' proposition is different. If someone makes that assertion I ignore them whereas you demand proof. What if someone asserts there is no after life? I don't think this proposition can be proved either and my attitude is one of "I don't care because there is nothing I can do to change what happens after death".

Brown was a 'greasy pole' climber once. Clear blue water is a strong strategy to deploy however it doesn't always work. Ask Michael Howard. Waiting till 2010 is a gamble given the business news this morning. Oil was predicted as climbing to $200 a barrel and India has just banned exports of certain types of rice. Imagine the implications for a country that's not self sufficient in energy or food if high prices and protectionism become the order of the day. The world economy may become a difficult place in 2010 and no wriggle room about setting Election Day. Having said that May 2010 seems like as good an aim point as any, certainly Brown can't afford another "Election that never was" when Ruth Kelly crowed "careful what you wish for" on Any Questions.

I think the Lisbon Treaty could well rise to prominence as a result of Labour in Scotland trying to goad the First Minister into an early independence referendum. One referendum will make us think of another. It will be ammunition for Cameron in 2010. Can you imagine "look at Labour in England they said they'd give you a referendum only once elected they deny you, in Scotland they said you couldn't have a referendum only to lose the election and call bring it on". See one sentence to show Labour up as serial ditherers. No doubt you could think of examples of Cameron dithering, but so what, Brown's the one with a job to lose.

How will the 'real opposition' react? As you know they have one position in the Commons and another in the House of Lords so who knows. Do they know what day it is? I don't think the 10p tax issue was as big a deal as it was made out to be. It was a handy smoke screen for an expected poor performance in the locals. (This is not to say that I think the low paid without children should be been forced to subsidise the 'with children' vote). I think you are right about kettenrad meaning chain wheel rather than chain drive. Make no mistake I enjoyed looking at the weird bikes. It occurred to me that we already have a common kettenrad which is called a snowmobile. I enjoyed reading the comments in the forum you linked especially the prospects of "knee down" action on a kettenrad.

I have set my machine up so that SO can switch the machine on and go straight to XP. If, like last night, I want to play with Linux I press F1 at the Intel logo and switch the boot disk. Thank you for all the advice about sound drivers. I must admit I hadn't thought of this. I think it was Gâr who pointed out that diet was the biggest factor in weight control, exercise was secondary. I always reckon that getting the bike out of the shed was exercise in itself. Enjoy the ride into the sunrise.

MDT

Evening rg.

My keyboard is slightly mucked so ignore any repeating gs

Proof. I am not sure it is really is proof that I am after is more trying to understand how people come to 'know' this sort of thing. I find the mindset completely baffling.

No afterlife. Another example of an unverifiable proposition except even worse. In principle if some says 'eternity exists' you can reasonably ask the proposer to give yo a testable existential predicate.

'The afterlife exists an can be accessed through a trans-temporal gateway on the Isle of Wight.'

Doesn't work with the negative proposition.

I think we should speak no more of this

greasy pole climbers. I think they all are now. Leave university. political researcher/lobbyist or somesuch. Selected as candidate (party unimportant). Get elected. Snout in trough access to GP or quiet life as lobby fodder (expenses, nice pensions, jollies and perks.

I recall a time when our representative were expected to have some considerable experience of the real world. No longer. In this context 'opposition' is just theatre to gull the punters.

Rant over.

2010: I am not convinced that Brown cares. As you say he looks ill - work related stress? Remember the change in Bambi? Perhaps, the job isn't it isn't as much fun as he thought and if you are right about the less than rosy future, then he might be considering an early bath.

Independence referendum: Gordy seems to have abandoned Wendy. You remember I said on one of the old referendum threads that I didn't see why, given that a majority would vote against independence that the unionist parties opposed the proposal.

I think Salmond is proving to be one of shrewder political operators on the UK. He is arguing that 2010 allows time for a 'national debate' on independence.

I don't think he expects to win a referendum, I think he is aiming to achieve a greater degree of devolution. Imagine how that will play in the English heartlands?

Cameron will also be bumped into producing a policy. His first?

10p tax. I think it was a wheeze that backfired. The actuality may be less important than the perception. A 'left wing' party that penalises the poor. Dave has now announced that his party will look after the poor....though of course he hasn't said how

Kettenrad . Difficult to tell from the picture but it looks like it might be some kind of transverse shaft drive. From the discussion, it seems that front steering wheel doesn't actual steer but translates into differential speeds for either track.

I've been trying to find out a bit more about the tracked 'replacement from the 'weird' bike site.

The tilting reverse trikes look interesting.

Linux: I see. I went a different route, I use a product called Acronis Disk Manager that replaces the MBR of the original OS so that you boot to a menu of the installed operating systems and just pick the one you want.

Soundcard Drivers: I suspect the availability may depend on how popular your soundcard is. I tend to stick with Soundblaster. If you can't get a driver you might want to identify an available driver and buy a card to match.

diet/exercise. Gar's probably right but I think the SO favours a two step approach. Diet for weight exercise to keep me nimble.

I have just realised that on the boat I tend to do all the physical stuff while she helms. This despite the fact that I am the better helmsman. Conned again.

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'Morning Bx4

Real world representation will only become possible if the 'popular' political parties change their selection preferences. Also I think there is something to be said for limiting the amount of time people can serve as MPs. If they know they can enjoy only a limited foray at the taxpayer's expense the hope is that they'll have a real career to come from and return to. I'm not sure I agree that opposition is purely theatre. In following the HoL LT (European Treaty Amendment) debate it is apparent that there is real animosity towards the EU project. The numbers appear to be stacked heavily in favour of the EU enthusiasts judging by the one division (that I'm aware of) held so far.

I think judging by his performance on the Ten o'clock (TV) news Gordon Brown will be taking an early bath lest he gets a grip. There he stood at the dispatch box putting Cameron 'right' about Wendy Alexander only for the BBC to put up three contemporary video clips of the Scottish Labour leader saying the opposite of what our PM purported to be her view. If this had happened a week ago Brown would have been run out of town. Brown is a fine one to talk about the SNP delaying their referendum after the LTR fiasco (ongoing). I'll bow to your superior knowledge of Scottish affairs and suppose that the referendum would be lost so far as the SNP were concerned.

Why did Cameron agree to being represented on the Devolution committee? Did he have a 'senior moment'? What possible good did he think it would do him? I agree that Dave flagging up the Conservatives as 'the party of the poor' will cut no ice with 'the poor' and do nothing to win over Labour voters. Perhaps this was a bit of political theatre to embarrass the government benches.

Yes I read about the kettenrad steering too. This does explain a lot. There is a tilting reverse scooter produced for the mass market by Italians (I think, though cannot remember the name). I did get a Linux driver for my soundcard though I didn't have a chance to install it. Time is the great constraint. Also it's far easier to switch to XP if I want to play with sound than muck around with "cd /usr/src/linux" and assorted other commands just to install a driver that may or may not work. Linux (in the 'distro' I've tried to date) looks like a great system with lots of frustrating road blocks.

Diet and Exercise – Of course and it only works if you work at it all the time. No yo-yo dieting if you don't want to put on weight long term.

MDT

Evening rg rg

Selection methods: I agree. Primaries in which everyone can vote?

Limited time. I agree. If it wasn't seen as a longterm/permanent career it might not attract the snouts and gpcs so much. It might be an idea to pay then the national average wage.

Opposition: I didn't mean that there are not people in politics who might have genuinely different views but that if you look at the way the clones actually do. Minor differences are spun to make them look like major disagreements.

HofL: Your dedication still continues to amaze. I had a read........

2200 CST. Missed it. I wonder who will have the earliest bath

Referendum delays: The SNP referendum isn't being delayed. The SNP manifesto promised it would be held in 2010, So Salmond can legitimately claim that to agree to Wendy's demands for an earlier one would be breaking a manifesto promise.

Lost: At the moment that seems to be the case. But it is a way of extorting more concessions out of the UK parliament.

Also remember that 'going' Tory is not that popular in Scotland. Did you catch the programme on R4 last night on Thatcher's 'Sermon on the Mound'?

Senior Moment: The unionist parties have set up something to called the Devolution Commission:

http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/news/display.var.2231446.0.Calman_devolution_commission_revealed.php

I don't know to much about it but it seems to be intended as an alternative to the SNP's 'National Conversation'

Skippies, Potato Heads and Cleggies in one bed......not wholly convincing, IMO

The poor: If it was political theatre I am not sure that it worked. I think the poor are a bit too sharp to be fooled by an Old Etonian.

Kettenrad: I rememember you mentioned the Sno-Cat didn't it have a tracked front wheel.... The British used something called the Weasel as an alternative.

Italian trike: Sounds interesting

Linux: I suppose it can be a bit intimidating. The universities adopted Unix early so I was exposed to it even before the shell appeared. My Linux is too heavily modified by supertekkies for me to dare mess about with it

I don't think once you get passed the learning curve any of the standard Linuxes (?) are too difficult. They are widely used here by commercial organisations as alternative to Windows.

Perhaps you should treat it as a hobby for when you can't ride/tinker with the burner.

Dieting: I don't really years of training ensure that I eat sensibly. Fortunately, apart from the odd malt and wine with meals, booze it not my MAS of choice. I do very occasionally, as with the labskaus, have the odd bit of indulgence in comfort food,

Being taken out for a meal tonight but I will be virtuous.....

bs

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'Morning Bx4

The network is well and truly down so I am unable to easily look at the Internet; I wanted to find out whether the turnout at primaries was good. It occurs to me that if people baulk at the idea of paying for referendums they wouldn't be keen on throwing more money at political parties so that the latter could preach at them even more. From my crazy viewing of the HoL (forthcoming dates 5/12, 5/14 & finally? 5/20) it is apparent that the Liberal Democrats could not be further removed from UKIP so far as the EU is concerned. I reckon in this respect UKIP deserve to be called 'the real opposition'. The LDs wouldn't be goaded into speaking in support of one their own MEPs who had exposed a "secret" embezzlement enquiry centred on the European Parliament.

I like the idea of paying MPs the average wage as I think as a group they do an average job (at best). Will it be Wendy or Gordon for the early bath? I know that Scotland and Wales seem to exhibit a long term aversion to the Tories. In the latter domain I understand the Liberal Democrats are picking up the Labour vote though I'm not surprised at this given that they share the same part of the spectrum. I didn't realise that the SNP manifesto gave a date for the referendum. This makes Ms Alexander's actions all the more bizarre.

Oh and the devolution commission – thank you for the link. Did you read any of the comments? "Who in all honesty is giving a flying frig about what this bunch of glorified self opinionated **** wasters think ? ...in the end it will rightly come down to the PEOPLE of Scotland to decide what they want ...not this bunch of freeloading wasters. The best thing to do with this bunch and others like them would be to ship them out to some offshore island and leave them there" (First comment on http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/news/display.var.2231446.0.Calman_devolution_commission_revealed.php ). In addition to membership of this committee, I think Cameron will also come to regret his 'party of the poor' comments. This was never going to more than a wheeze to embarrass Labour MPs (who never vote Tory anyway).

I don't find Linux intimidating because I'm used to weird environments like Foxpro and Access. I agree it is a hobby for me to be fitted in when I don't want to watch one of SO's soaps or there isn't a ketten to be maintained. I had a play last night and discovered the joys of compressed files and the open office package. I'm pleased you've got your diet on an even keel I wish I could say the same. I listened to the first twenty minutes of Today; I think they were going to have a Catholic Archbishop and Richard Dawkins on later. This sort of thing is better done on TV where Sky has revived the Gladiators format.

MDT

Evening rg;

Network: A putsch seems advisable to break the power of the tekkies.

Primaries: Not sure. Fairly busy today only a little bit 'sucked' in on Noahs Flood. All done: I can leave - the boxer beckons.

Had good news today - we have apparently being doing better than anticipated so the half yearly profit share is most promising (and in euros). Boxer 2 is assured.

Paying: LTR1, maybe.

HofL. I am not sure that the Liberals under Clegg are convincing on any level but I am not persuaded by a party whose policies include denying anthropogenic global warming have much to offer.

I have no idea how many UKIP peers there are but I suspect most are disaffected Tories so it won't change the numbers much.

Embezzlement: A special area of expertise for UKIP if the Mote and Wise Show is anything to go by:

http://ukipwatch.org/2007/11/mote-ukip-and-bunch-of-tits.html
http://ukipwatch.org/2005/10/wise-lies-land-tom-in-hot-water.html

Early Baths: Gordy may survive for who is a 'convincing' replacement.
Wendy may be a more likely candidate she was already in hot water over election expenses. Somewhat oddly, Labour in Scotland shows an almost Tory-like turnover of party leaders.

Comments: Yes saw them. I agree with them the Commission is not convincing. For obvious reasons the choice of island would be important. Isle of Wight?

Wendy: She is indeed bizarre since prior to her recent conversion she was vehemently against.

Weird environments. I am not sure Access is that weird. I remember Foxpro vaguely but I have never used it.

I think Linux once you have it setup is fairly trouble free and at least unlike XP you can poke about a bit.

OO is quite impressive, especially given that is free and cross-platform.

Today: I missed it. There is a new thread about Cardinal Cormac thingy but Dawkins wasn't mentioned. Seems to be turning into a new delusion thread.....I think I'll stay out of it even though some of things the new top atheist on the thread is saying..........

Weasel: apparently it was a winterised version of the Studebaker M79 Weasel. See showroom 11 here:

http://www.nat-military-museum.lu/pageshtml/vehiclesandartillery.php

Apparently they also used two converted Ferguson tractors and something called a Muskeg

The Russians were much more impressive:

http://www.southpolestation.com/trivia/igy1/dralkin1.html

Anyhow must pack. Not really. One of the benefits of the new arrangement is that I can travel light so just a shoulder bag with a couple of books, cds and a lot of sausage and other local goodies.

But I do have to start shutting place down and see neighbours and local factotum.

Have a good weekend

bs