h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

New journal entry for a house we looked at today.

There are two links below. The first is the real estate listing which shows most of the first floor. The second is a link to my Picasa album where I have posted photos of some of the details on the second floor as well as of the entry foyer.

I need advice of course, so I'll post a separate posting in a little bit breaking down some pros and cons- and I might not want to discuss them all here, so some of you may hear from me via email or Facebook.

Someone else was there while we were looking at it, so for all we know they've already signed a purchase agreement or something...


http://www.movoto.com/il/3119-n-springfield-ave-chicago/461_07339702.htm

http://picasaweb.google.com/ofelia.payne/HouseHunting#

I really like it from the outside and it looks like a good size. I think it has a lot of potential but it also needs a lot of work. If you're up for it- great! I'd also want to know why the ceilings downstairs have been covered the way they have and I'd want to know how high they really are and what the false ceiling is hiding.

What's the pinkish room right at the front for? Kind of looks like an indoor porch as it's unfurnished but I couldn't quite figure it out..

I like the stained glass window - and are the upstairs ceilings real plasterwork like that or are they fake? Be a pain to paint and maintain I imagine.

The upstairs walls and ceilings are covered with painted textured tin.

The pink room is an enclosed porch- it used to be a veranda that was bricked in. That's why the front of the house is brick and the rest is stucco.

We didn't see any damage above the dropped ceiling and it appears to go up about 8"-1' above. No idea why they did that.

The downstairs bathroom would have to be completely redone. And the kitchen is TINY. I'm afraid it might drive me nuts.

Good size- yes. Around 2000 sq ft which is about what we need.

In the upstairs I think I would want to remove the second kitchen (and move that old stove into the real kitchen) and take out the center wall (not tin covered) between the two smaller of the four upstairs rooms to make it one room. The front part could be attic storage, the rest of it could have our books and CDs and a spare bed.

The other reason I'd want to pull that wall up there down is that there are only two heat registers up there.

We'd also need to buy a washer and dryer, replace the garage door (around $1500) and install central air (around $4K as it already has forced air heat; just upgrade the blower and put the aircon in, no ductwork needed). Eventually I'd want to upgrade the kitchen cabinets too.

Since the listing shows the list price, I should add that while we can afford that, we're not prepared to pay that. We'd be offering less.

All this would of course be contingent on the home passing an inspection, or we'd never obtain financing.

The cons... well, there are some. What I'm having the hardest time with is breaking out in a cold sweat just thinking about it. I'm not convinced we're not better off riding out the lease (April 2012) then moving to a 3BR 2ba rental unit with central a/c.

We also looked at a nice townhouse we liked... it needed NO work and had a more substantial kitchen, but is very vanilla and without all the character of the other place. I'm a sucker for built-in woodwork (it was the built-ins and the clawfoot tub that sold me on our current place in 2002) and stained glass, and I love enclosed sun porches.

Oh- and the fireplace in that place appears to be functional (though the townhouse has one of those, too).

GAH!

The stained glass window feels good, would convince me that previous owner/builder had put love into the place.

What the hell is that cushion thing on the ceiling?

Kitchen looks fine to me.

The rest seems to be a blank slate, waiting for you to imprint your own personalities upon it.

Generally good feeling; personally;'id be unhappy about lack of boundary fencing but i get the impression that is usual in USA?

zdt

Pressed tin is something I associate with houses older than that one. There's nothing wrong with it; I'm just mentioning it as a bit of useless information.

An enclosed verandah would be useful in winter...

Terri, I think the 'cushion thing' is a light fitting of some sort. That can easily be fixed.

Terri- this house has a fence all the way around the backyard. Fencing is typical, even in exurban areas, though some people do not use it. It would be unheard of in the city.

All of the windows in the living and dining room are stained glass.

I don't know what you mean by cushion on the ceiling, unless you mean the dropped ceiling with the fluorescent light in it? Yes, that could be removed.

Enclosed veranda is neither heated nor air conditioned and I expect the 2nd floor isn't controlled as well as the first.

Kitchen cabinets are that old metal stuff and would have to go. We'd need a portable dishwasher as a built-in one would never fit. And there's no fridge in there so we'd have to remove a shelf from the pantry to accommodate one. That kitchen is *really tiny*. I don't know how well I'd cope- I've usually had bigger than that even in my small apartment.

So it'd be about an extra $10K just to move in, not including furture removal of dropped ceiling and associated painting, removal of that inner wall on the second floor, and renovating both bathrooms (first floor is critical, second not so much). Plus we'd need to pull up all that carpet, move it to the second floor, rip up the kitchen tile, and make sure the hardwood flooring underneath was ready to go before moving in, obviously.

I don't know if what it is I'm doubting is any given place in particular, or if I'm just less keen on owning property than I think I am... and not just because of the responsibility and the taxes!

Incidentally.. good grief, does Picassa web suck. I can't add ANY comments to my photos to explain what's what. In fact, I can barely get the stupid things to load at all.

Honestly. I'm getting NO advice from anyone in regards to potential costs of updating/ remodeling / replacing stuff. Most of my friends have no opinion or input to offer. K's noncomittal. Our parents aren't forthcoming with any wisdom. The selling agent is pressuring us. And I can't even get decent photos- other people scheduled their appointment at the same time as us, rudely, and I didn't want them to see me taking photos or anything or if they were interested they might try to put in an offer before us. Now I get a few photos and I can't show them to anyone or add any comments.

If I believed there was "anybody out there", I'd swear this was a "sign" and just quit looking.

hmm, interesting looking place. Is the passage down the side private or is a public walk through to somewhere?
Also the shot of the shuttered blinds - is that overlooking next door and straight into their side windows?
As for the decor - hmmmmmm, very 'interesting' choice of ceiling tiles and wallpaper. And as for the kitchen tiles - Yeuch!
I'd also want to get rid of the bloke on the stairs in the final photo, might be a bit intrusive

Tiles in the bathroom look a tad wonky in places. But it all seems clean.

Unfortunately I have no idea what any of that costs over the pond so can't help there! It looks, from the photos, like one of those places you could probably live as is - but if you want to make it a home you'll need to spend reasonable money just to keep it all up to standard.

By the side passage I assume you mean the sidewalk along the side of the house- that leads to the main entry and is not a public walk. We could even fence it off at some point if desired.

The shuttered blind shots are all from second floor windows. Those do indeed overlook the second floor next door. All homes are that close together here in the city- that's the just way it is.

The living room wallpaper would go, and that pink bathroom would be totally redone. The black and white bathroom is the second floor bath and could be redone much later if needed. The pink one (carpeted!) needs to go. The ceilings in the second link are all the pressed tin stuff, which we actually really liked... looked like plaster but easier to maintain.

Yes, it would need a bit of work. At what we can afford, most places we see do need some.

And yes, the kitchen tiles are ugly. Not sure I hate the wood panels, but I wondered if we might someday remove the back porch and the separate entry to the second floor (that big brown stairway in the back) and expand the kitchen a bit...

yes, that's what I meant - that's ok then. Providing it provides enough width for any use you have.

The pressed tin stuff - yeah, it doesn't look badly done. Just a little OTT for such a house But that's personal preference!

As for a bit of work - yes, but it does seem pretty much to be cosmetic stuff (other than sorting out the white goods) so you can do it at your leisure as and when the money/time is available.

What's the neighbourhood like?

Also - the door next to the stained glass window in your photos looked a bit tired, would you be wanting or needing to change doors/windows?

Oh, and meant to ask. What's an "English basement" and what does "with 1/2bath(rough-in) " - surely half a bath would lead to rather excessive damp problems?

A half bath usually means sink and toilet, no tub or shower. This place has a full bath on each floor and a "roughed in" toilet in the basement. Basically, in the basement is a small cubby with a door with a toilet inside, so if you're down there doing laundry or working, and you have to go, you don't have to run all the way up. Not needed, but I'd use it if I had it. A lot of older houses around here have them for whatever reason.

English basment means that the basement has separate access to the outside- there are stairs down inside the house, but also a door to the backyard via the basement itself.

The neighborhood's the same on we're in now (same postal code, even), a mile futher west and a mile further south. It's not affluent but not terrible. Working class, mixed ethnicity though mostly whites and Hispanics. Its close to the same train stop I use now- just a little further.

The door next to the darker colored window is the entry door, and in person it looks really good, actually. It looked a lot worse in the photo for some reason. But yeah, it can be replaced or refinished if needed. The windows, excepting the stained glass ones, are actually all relatively new. As is the roof, furnace, water heater and paint.

I thought if anything the tin was less OTT than maybe some people might find cheap or tacky. It has chaacter!

You can't see the garage in any of the photos. It'd hold two cars, and is detached from the house. It has a door to the backyard and then opens to the alley, like most garages in this area.

Now, I'm not an expert in materials so I wondered if tin is a good idea for ceilings?
A) from a chemical composition point of view
B) insulation point of view
C) maintenance point of view

Also, although I'm familiar with a 'Florida' room, which can be quite useful, but how would the enclosed porch work in Chicago?

Upstairs I think changing the rooms sounds good from a practicality point of view, but here in the UK you're always warned off doing this sort of thing as it would decrease the value of the house.

Downstairs, the kitchen would drive me crazy if it's too small.

There are certain things you can change in a house and certain things you can't.
Location, light, plot and density you have to live with - most everything else you can change with (a lot of) effort and money. Layout can also be tricky to deal with, such as moving / resizing kitchens and bathrooms.

I think you're hesitant not because of budget / commitment issues, but the sheer amount of work you have in mind to do. Don't get seduced by the original features alone though - you can add character anywhere.

One thing this place has obviously over the townhouse is the slightly increase distance of the neighbours. There's no sound that carries as much as children playing / shouting / arguing etc. and a townhouse would have to be hugely well soundproofed.

All good points!

I'm sure the walls are insulated and the tin is up there in lieu of say, replacing drywall or putting up paneling or something. An inspector would be able to tell for sure- and since we're applying for FHA insured financing any offer would be contingent upon passing inspection. Otherwise, no loan.

The enclosed porch would be useful during nicer weather- aside from opening the double glass doors and then opening windows, during nicer weather it could be used for sitting. There are electrical outlets out there, so we could bring our little electric radiator or a fan out there, and a lamp. During summer I'd likely move some plants out there. Otherwise it's just as useful as it would have been had they not walled it in.

Yes, a small kitchen might make me nuts. I sincerely think that is the only thing holding me back.

Without disclosing too much... FHA only requires a 3% downpayment. Were we to offer $175K, using our savings, we could put as much as $36K (20%) down and still have as much left over. We could then definitely also afford to get dishwasher (portable), washer and dryer, replace the garage door and have aircon installed ASAP, and hopefully pull up the carpet on the first floor and sand/finish those if needed. The flooring bit isn't too hard.

The other fixing up- bathroom, ceiling removal- could wait and be done one thing at a time, especially when I get my annual bonuses at work.

I'm working with some measurements we took in the living and dining rooms to get a handle on how our furniture would fit in.

The biggest issue for me is that the current monthly payment estimate is based on the current property tax year (here, it is one year behind, so they *just* paid 2009). The prior owner was a senior citizen (this is an estate sale) and got the senior tax exemption on property tax. So it'd be $2900 for the first couple years, but by the beginning of 2012 would at least double, which increases our monthly payments. Our lender will escrow for homeowner's insurance and property tax so we don't have to come up with it all at once, but it'd still be an increase of $200-$300 a month. I'm afraid of taking on payment terms that would require too much of our net income.

Thanks to everyone who's commenting and helping me think all this through. All the points and counterpoints are helpful, even if you don't think you have anything "expert" to add.

Positive features, though- obviously the wood built-ins, fireplace, stained glass and hardwood floors. Also, except for the brick part around the porch, it's stucco, my favorite. MUCH cheaper homeowner's insurance than wood, too. And having two functional full baths makes remodeling them easier- use one while the other is being repaired.

And yes... sharing two common walls was the biggest "put off" regarding the townhouse. They had an end unit for rent and I told K if our lease was up *this* April instead of 2012, we'd just rent that instead and buy someday when we've saved more and can maybe get a better interest rate.

I have in-house Government employed Energy Inspector here; if that would help; if someone would pay his travel expenses; i'm sure he'd be delighted to assess the place, attach solar panels (to cut electric bills)...but he probably wouldn't approve of the dishwasher "what's wrong with a kettle for just two people?"

I inherited a dishwasher with an apartment in Middle East, ye gods, what a waste of space & time, you have to rinse the stuff beforehand, whilst doing that you may as well wash it up properly!

zdt

>>increase of $200-$300 a month<<

By that point, would your monthly mortgage have dropped some though? Enough to offset?

Oh, no, Terri, even if we were serious, solar power is WAY too expensive here in Chicago at this point in time.

Dishwasher- I definitely need it. And you should never rinse first. If you don't leave food on, the soap scratches the dishes.

But... unless this place stays on the market indefinitely, it may not even be an issue, due to recent unforeseen circumstances I can't discuss here.

Eeek, sounds grim, my wooh.

Me too have stuff me no discuss here; email me ja?

*wanders off to wash dishes at 4a.m*

zdt

Oh noes! Hope everyone is OK.

Emails sent to those who expressed concern. I can't discuss here for legal reasons, and will now unsub from this thread so as not to torment myself by daydreaming further about this house, for the time being.