h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Or a female monkey, in Spanish...

The Addams Family seemed the epitome of Gothic style.

New to Gnomon's Guide today:

Entry A87859345 Ireland and What to Call It

This discusses the various names of Ireland, the bits of it and how they may lead to confusion.

May the wind be at your back as you travel the road to Confusion .

And whatever happens, may the road refrain from rising up to meet you (ouch).

Nice, and clear too.

Éire/Éireann: these are not nominative and accusative but nominative and genitive, so you should perhaps say 'of Ireland'. My Christian Brothers Grammar tells me that nominative, accusative and dative are all called 'the common form', the only forms distinct from it being the genitive and vocative.

So Mná na h-Éireann. But in the back of my mind is a different dative or ablative "ag taisteal go h-Éirinn". We'll have to consult someone more knowledgeable about that.

[ to look for Druids who might know ]

My daughter has a degree in Irish. She'd know. She's in China at the moment, but is not very busy this week, so I'll ask her.

OK, here's what I've discovered, without consulting the daughter in China:

Erin

In some dialects of Irish, the name for Ireland is ÉirinnÉirinn is also the dative case of Éire in all dialects of Irish, but this shouldn't concern English speakers. rather than Éire, and this has been brought into English as 'Erin'. You'll find this name for the island in many old songs in English. Since these were written before the formation of the Republic, the name Erin can be taken to refer to the whole island.

What do you think, R?

[I can add nothing to this discussion, sad to say...]

That's great. Perhaps we shouldn't say 'this is irrelevant for English speakers' because the point is to show the source for 'Erin'. They can disregard it at their own leisure.

I would see it as an equivalent derivation to 'Jove', taken from the dative or ablative of Iovis (by Jove!). The nominative or vocative was not necessarily the commonest usage for a name.

Dative, nomitive, vocative... that's all Greek to me so I also have nothing to add.

As Flanders and Swann said, this isn't irrelevant, this is irhippotamus!

http://www.google.com/search?q=hippopotamus,+images&newwindow=1&client=tablet-android-verizon&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CDwQ7AlqFQoTCIiW_ffz5ccCFYo2iAodrAgGBw&biw=962&bih=601#imgrc=0WqEuNsoVxzY5M%3A

http://www.google.com/search?q=sea+cow,+images&newwindow=1&client=tablet-android-verizon&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CD4Q7AlqFQoTCKHxi7_05ccCFco3iAody34Mkg&biw=962&bih=601#imgrc=GMu29d4WIxdSPM%3A


http://www.google.com/search?q=walrus,+images&newwindow=1&client=tablet-android-verizon&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CDwQ7AlqFQoTCP60n7P15ccCFco6iAodg3EMGg&biw=962&bih=601#imgrc=XPgMdl9EFVMbmM%3A

Well the point is that the form Eirinn (which is the dative in some parts of Ireland) is used as the nomnitive in Conamara, hence the name Erin.

So if you're in Conamara, Erin is okay to use.

Ar Éirinn ní neosfainn cé hí -- a well known Irish song. Translates as 'for Ireland I would not tell who she (is)'. Poetically translated as 'for Ireland I'd not tell her name.'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayOVvGZjZu8 --listen about two and a half minutes in for the title line.

The relevance of that is that 'ní neosfainn' is apparently a particularly Munster way of saying 'I would not tell' (part of the verb 'innis'). So that seems to be a Munster usage of Éirinn, an inflection suitable after 'Ar' ('for' in this context).

Wouldn't 'ar' take yge dative in sll dialects?