h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

>> did we have god given free will before or after eve ate the apple? <<
I feel sure, it was before. That's why Adam & Eve made 'the mistake'.

>> But what kind of truth? <<
Well, I see a common theme throughout:

F19585?thread=5985941&post=74167837#p74166987

ie. the first of the 10 commandments given to Moses at Mt. Sinai

I am the Lord your God, You shall have no other gods before me.

"Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy"

as you follow all three versions of god, when is your sabbath??? Friday Saturday or Sunday

but don't say all 3 because then you are breaking

"for six days shall you labour and do all of your work"

>> did we have god given free will before or after eve ate the apple? <<
<<I feel sure, it was before. That's why Adam & Eve made 'the mistake'.>>

can the ignorant be said to have free will or is it just instinct, how can they make an informed choice

>> but don't say all 3 because <<

Ah, you've got me there!
Ho, well I suppose my sabbath is Sunday because I live in a predominately Christian country.
I am very concerned, though, that it is being eroded. 10 years ago, our local indoor shopping centre was shut on
Sunday. Now it is open 7 days a week and the staff are expected to work anytime.

I go to worship in a masjid (or mosque) on Fridays at midday. I'm not sure
if the Synagogue will have me.

Surely the best way to check whether the Bible stories are fictional is to look at the evidence?

Let's take the Flood, for example. There is no geological evidence of a massive global flood at or around the time the Bible claims. Nor is there any sign of a mass extinction event at that time. Nor is there archaeological evidence of massive global cultural disruption. Indeed, Egyptian written history goes right through the date of the Flood without noticing it.

Can we agree that this story, at least, is fictional (or at best so inaccurate that it might as well be fictional)?

Gif

>> Can we agree that this story, at least, is fictional (or at best so inaccurate that it might as well be fictional)? <<

Nope!
I suppose Dr. Who knows more about time & infinity and related concepts ( ) than me.

>Nope !

So how are you proposing we decided whether Bible stories are fictional or not? Or is this just a survey of opinions?

Gif

the flood has been attributed to the med breaking into the black sea and flooding it as several different cultures that originated in the area have similar flood mythologies.

I think that's covered by "at best so inaccurate that it might as well be fictional."

So, if Bible stories are fictional, then 'the God' of the Bible doesn't exist, right ?

And if He doesn't exist, then is there any 'being' superior to ourselves
that mankind is aware of ?
If the answer to that is no, then mankind is supreme, right ?

That's a shame! I'm not very happy with his supremacy. all that bloodshed and injustice.

and how much bloodshed and injustice has been perpetrated in the name of god???????

Well:

(a) there could be god(s) other than the Biblical one.

(b) even if god(s) don't exist, that doesn't make mankind 'supreme' (except in our own minds).

(c) the fact that you are uncomfortable with an idea is not, by itself, a reason to think that it is not true.

Gif

Taff,
Surely any man alive can create his own 'group' of people or belong to a
certain tribe etc. and proclaim "kill this other tribe in the name of god", whatever their god is.

I must also 'point out strongly' that somebody who believes in 'the Supreme God'
and is sincerely following his guidance with conscience
would not automatically side with:

1). His nation
2). His primary religious group
3). A wealthy group
4). His family or friends etc ...

in an (armed) dispute.

eg. If Iran attacked Israel with nuclear weapons of a serious capacity,
Iran would, imo, be totally in the wrong with such an action.
It is totally forbidden to kill 'civilians' comprising of women and children.

So, I don't believe that religion or science is to blame, but mankind are
whether they are religious or not.

Hi Warner,

Not sure what you mean by that last Post. Currently in the news, Israel is bombing Gaza, apparently with the blessing of rabis:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1180527966693&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

Meanwhile the Hamas response is to declare Israeli civilians legitimate targets:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article5454204.ece

So if you're saying it is possible for a strong-minded individual to break with their nation, religion and friends and stand up to this sort of thing - yes, I believe that (and certainly hope it is true). But if you're saying it's usual, I would say sadly not. Virtually every religious person *does* side with their faith, nation and 'tribe' when it comes to killing.

Gif

you are not happy with mankind's injustice and bloodshed

yet the crusades were inspired by the religion of the day

dispensations were give by the church "killing an infidel was not murder and you would be rewarded in heaven"

all by the pope in the name of god

Well, I think what I'm trying to say is that

"Nationalism is not what God wants from us". He wants us to be more like Him
with truth and justice.
If we have reason to be proud with our nation (we feel they are just etc.)
then as long as it's not taken to extreme.

I also think that the world wouldn't have survived this long if
God hadn't intervened with mankind in the past.

We've reached the 'final episode' now and He's let us have our 'nuclear bombs' etc. and

the final and last intervention before 'total destruction' is
the return of 'Jesus son of Mary'.

And how do you know all that?

Gif

Gif

Are you comfortable in this universe, with mankind in charge ?
Perhaps you can accept that the universe has no reason for being here; I can't.

Following from that, for me, is why is it here then ?
I'm satisfied that I've found a good answer. If anybody comes up with a better one,
I 'm listening attentively.

we are behaving like god

"do as i say or i will smite thee"

Sodom and Gomorrah ground zero for the first divine nukes

an eye for an eye

i am vengeance so sayest the lord

how much more like him can we become??????

Taff, yes I know.

When I first started reading 'the style' you are describing from some of the
scriptures, I also rejected it.


The problem with mankind is that they don't tend to take things seriously
unless they have some fear of the consequences. Like a youth who
runs wild etc.
Wrong is wrong, and can't be made right by any belief or disbelief.