h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

that went quick!

some photos coming up for anyone who wants a nosey..mostly of josh n my gorgeous nephews

"what"????

http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/gedg42/album?.dir=5624re2&.src=ph

xmas of course..

"oh yeah that"

Very nice

yep, concurs.

You celebrate Christmas?

I'd have thought you were more likely to celebrate the wintersolstice and the birth of the new year.

I at least light a few candles and have a reflect at solstice if I'm not up to a full rite as I wasn't really this year. I don't have a problem with christmas really as its very pagan anyway, consisting mostly of beliefs pinched from Yule n Saturnalia celebrations even santa has pagan origins.
I have a 9 year old son too and its nice for him and the other kids

Well said Serephina I'm getting a bit old to 'do' Arbor Low on the solstice (too damned cold to camp - it has been known to snow many a time in Derbyshire at this time of year - and not matter how thirsty you are don't eat yellow snow) and christmas is as near as dammit anyway. Candles, little rituals at the altar...so long as the solstice is observed in some way, forgive us christmas.

>>even santa has pagan origins.

And our survey said...*insert uh-err noise here*

While much of the Christmas traditions, the christmas tree for instance, have their origins in pagan ceremonies and traditions, Saint Nicholas was bishop of Myra in C4. He would have been a fairly well off person at the time due to an inheritance from his perants death while he was a child, but he followed Christ's instructions to sell his belongings and give his money to help the poor. Because of this and other tales of his giving gifts to help the poor he has become associated with the giving of gifts. In fact depending on where you live Santa visits on different days of the year.

I reckon most religions/belief systems/whatever tend to have some sort of knees-up at least once a year; if only to let off steam. It's probably some sort of fundamental human thing. It's really rather nice to give presents, eat yummy food & try desperately to be nice to the rest of the world (with the possible exception of in-laws...but it is character building to at least try.)

And it's Definitely a great idea for kids!

zdt

Christianity's rife with pagan tradition. Halos are originally from the Roman pagan beliefs, many Celtic saints are actually heroes from the Celtic pagan myths and legends. Christianity learned early on that the best way to be accepted over the local pagan beliefs is to absorb them into christianity. This is one reason there is much in Christianity that has little or no relationship to the teachings of Christ.

Now let's not kick all mils in the teath , my mil who is 78 grew our sprouts especially for our xmas lunch cause they are very difficult to get over here, even grew enough for gmil who's 99 to have some xmas lunch too . .

I think I'm very lucky to have a very nice mil this time around not only is she taking care of a bed ridden mil she spends most of her time on 2 large allotments for all her family and gets the rice tambo ready and planted every year

Aha but santa has more origins than just saint nick parts of the santa/father christmas myth also evolved from the god saturnalia and odin and his wild hunt! hes a real mish mash..

Ah, you're thinking of the US santa, which is a jolly Dutch burgher and was created to sell stuff, and don't even get me started on Father Christmas. The elves? and Lapland? Some USian toy company executive needs a smack in the mouth.

Santa originates from St Nicholas and it was only the close proximity of 6th of December which got him associated with Christmas. All the other stuff is just there to sell toys.

Yes we have a tree at christmas, yes I throw offerings into wells and other water sources, yes I have two offspring, one of whom is a wolf and the other being a giant snake who encircles the earth...Wait, forget I said that last bit!!!!!!!

I hate to correct you, TB, but the modern Santa is based on a poem by Clement Clarke Moore. You can read the whole poem at http://www.christmas-tree.com/stories/nightbeforechristmas.html if you like; though many countries have their own versions, this is the one that gave rise to the current Western version. There is no truth whatsoever in the legend that Santa was created or embellished by a soft drinks company.

There are Saints's days for every day of the year, and as far as they go 6th December is quite a long way from 25th - there are 19 Saints days in between. As far as I'm aware, the modern festival is an adaptation of older celebrations, and Nick is the patron saint of children, theives and sailors - read into that what you will

I have no belief in the Christian festivals, but I don't think statements like 'All the other stuff is just there to sell toys' should go unchallenged. The idea of seasonal rewards for good deeds goes back centuries in many European countries, and certainly predates disposable income - if it's all about selling stuff, one must surely have some spare cash with which to buy that stuff. I guess it's far easier to pick on old materialistic Christmas than the old honest tuppenny in a well, isn't it?

Actually, that poem was written in 1822, Santa, as in the modern US version, originated with the New York Historical Society, specificly with a work by Washington Irving who was a member of the same, but you were only out by a few years

Yes, the giving of gifts does date back pre US Santa, but much of the current santa paraphinalia is designed to sell stuff. Also I would point out that in the old Julian calendar St Nicholas' day, what is now the 6th, was then 19th of December, so it was even closer to christmas. Anyway the tradition of gift giving on St Nicholas' Day and Christmas day became merged in some countries, although in others the gifts are still given on the 6th.

Finally I'm not sure what you're getting at with your last sentence.

It only shows that it's different in different countries. As I told Sereph only recently, we have St Nicholas here, he brings small gifts like sweets and fruits to the children on 6th December. We then have either the Weihnachtsmann (Father Christmmas?) or the Christkind (Which is known as Kris Kringle in the USA) to bring gifts to the children on Christmas Eve. My sister told me, that the Christkind was an invention of Martin Luther (10 November, 1483 - 18 February, 1546), to have something different to the Weihnachtsmann of the Catholics. What's really interesting is, that today's Christkind actually is more important in Catholic regions and with Catholic families, and the Weihnachtsmann for the Protestants.

I haven't got a clue either, TB. Unfortunately, it appears that I popped online last night while extremely drunk (posting anywhere at 4am after a party isn't a good idea). In fact, the first inkling I had that I'd been online was seeing my posting here just now - the small hours are very hazy in my memory

So, apologies for my drunken ramblings. I wonder where else I went last night?