h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Entry: Haku form - the myth of 575 in writing English haiku - A806573
Author: paul t conneally - U200745

This entry should be cross referenced to the "haiku" entry in h2g2. The haiku currently being written on the haiku challenge entries (conversation) clearly show that whilst enjoying writing in 575 form (and producing some entertaining short poems) most writers are not writing "haiku" - many are perhaps "senryu" but again the sticking to 575 so slavishly can a times produce fairly tortuous poems.

I hope that the entry will provide a useful other way into haiku as practised by haijin.

All thats best,

Paul Conneally

IMHO your points *are* covered in the entry A222922 although the 'Haiku Challenge' threads ( F55683?thread=93649 and F60663?thread=100878 and others) take the freedom to stick to 5-7-5 and use whatever phrase comes in handy (ie: kigo or not).

However, If I'm just too dumb to notice the point then you should perhaps see what there is to do with A222922 and contact the h2g2 Update HQ at A496451

* tempted to close with a haiku, but I'm afraid I'd be doing it wrong *

Yes I think that much of this is covered in the haiku entry that you mention - probably the main new point might be the "phrase and fragment" approach to actually writing haiku.

Go on - have a go at writing one - just see what comes - the good thing about haiku is that they are great for conveying something from ones life just as it is - a poetry without too much poetics!

The best haiku (some say all real haiku) come from actual experience so have a go - perhaps try the phrase and fragment approach!

paul

I am so afraid
sticking to seventeen syll-
ables is so diff---

See, there's even a fragment in it

a bit like John Cooper Clarkes famous haiku (even same last word!)


so try forgeting the 17 syllables - paul

hey, it's your turn now!

white lilac
the knife grinder's wheel
throwing up sparks

paul conneally

well, well... so that's a *real* haiku then

OK. I have to confess to being rather confused.

And the point is?

IMHO the point is the 'fragment' or season related part at the top (sometimes the bottom) of a real haiku, which bears allusions to us being involved in the world's proceedings and opens the mind to influences far beyond our consciousness, combining past and future with the depth of one's unconsciousness in the process.


Or somesuch

Hey! Great! Although i'd say its not the fragment part alone (and the seasonal reference "kigo" - when present - can be in the phrase just as well as the fragment) but the juxtopostion of the two elements that does contributes to all you said above. Allusive variation helps us in that crossing time, space and culture connectiveness that you write of.

morning haze
my head has become
last nights pillow

paul conneally

The blackness throughout
My mind reels from falling so
far and so quickly.

That one was just off the cuff. Did I do okay?

In fact, perhaps it would serve the article to put up a few genuine attempts @ haiku and pointing out the errors... (Maybe some of the funny, if not perfect ones to lighten the mood a bit.)

Anyway, I thought your article was very interesting and I intend to print it out and show it to my creative writing teacher who maintains that all one needs to be able to write haiku is the ability to count. (I've seen some "haiku" that are just collections of words with nothing to link them that happen to add up to the correct amount of syllables.)

Hope I was helpful! Keep up the good work!

-Lucrecia

Hi L.

"The blackness throughout
My mind reels from falling so
far and so quickly."

I like your poem - still hooked on 575 though!

I'd say that perhaps (a bit like my last offering) its not quite concrete enough for some haijin and can be read as one sentence rather than as two juxtoposed parts in its present form - for purists a seasonal word or reference would be valued too. Keep on writing and read lots of haiku by recognised haijin! (both in English and English translation).

Once you've been told that haiku should be 575 its sometimes hard to move on fully and begin to recognise haiku and appreciate them for the other things that make them "haiku". The search for "haikuness" has led most practising haijin (Clark Strand excluded) to assert that what makes poem a haiku has nothing at all to do with exact syllable count (in English at least).

You are right in suggesting that reading examples of haiku by recognised haijin is a good way in - I'd suggest the "Haiku Handbook" by William J Higginson and also his "Haiku World" and its companion "The Haiku Seasons (poetry of the natural world)" - all the big internet book markets will have them (buy your teacher one!).

You might also try the internet haiku publications "World Haiku Review" and "The Heron's Nest". A search using any engine should take you to them. "Temps Libre haiku" or "Free Times haiku" searched for should take you to Serge Tomes excellent haiku reading room and is in two languages too!

blackberry stains
he brings home a handful
of green acorns

All that's best,

Paul T Conneally

I don't think this entry should be become an Edited Entry as it stands. It is repeating much of what is in the existing entry on Haikus. I think that extra bits that this entry provides should be posted as a Conversation to the existing entry. You could ask Anna to later incorporate them into the existing entry.

Thanks Gnomon - you're right - the entry that Anna has in is pretty good - there are some other entries that need making perhaps on some of the great haiku masters, Bios etc - for instance I searched Shiki - some say the father of "modern" haiku with his "shasei" or sketch from life approach - and the guide only comes up with a restaurant recomendation called Shiki!

best,

Paul Conneally

An electric buzz
This thread should be taken
from Peer Review

Paul - you should follow the instructions here: <./>DontPanic-ReviewForums#12</.>

agreed. Now all it takes is another Scout's vote...

will do it now!


paul