h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

With all the discussion about hate crimes ("crimes aginst a person because of there race, sex, sexuality, or any other stupid reason") it accured to me, are not all crimes hate crimes????

If you love someone you want only the best for them. You would not steal from them or cause them harm. If you truely love someone you would not rape, assault, or murder them. Would You???

Therefore all crimes are hate crimes.

Picture a scenario:

You are happily married to your perfect soul mate. There is nothing you would not do for him/her. He/she has terminal cancer, with agonising pain, and is losing his/her dignity and quality of life. Your partner begs you that when things become unbearable, you will help them take their life. You cannot bear to see them suffering, so you agree. The time finally arrives, and your partner asks you to help them end their life. You give them a drink laced with morphine (which your partner has been given for pain). It is a fatal dosage, which you and your partner is well aware of. Your partner dies a peaceful and dignified death.
Technically you have committed murder. Is it a crime of hate or a crime of love?

Interesting.

Is it a crime? Not in all states or in all countries is mercy killing a crime, but I see your point. I would have to fall back on the old adage "Do no harm". Are you doing harm by helping a person die with dignity and without pain or are you doing harm by making them live in an incapacitated state.

I used to work in a cancer unit, and looked after a lot of terminally ill people. I had many long chats with relatives about exactly this situation, and I still haven't got any nearer to working out what is right.

- Adam

My father-in-law had a cerebral hiemridge (sp? For bleeding) in Nov 97 and was brain dead by the ambulance arrived to get him. His Family had to decide weather to keep him on life supports or remove them and let him go. They let him go and we were in the room so he was not alone when he died. I understand what they are going though, at lest as much as I can.

There is another scenario, too.

A person from a Third World country has a some children. You have no money and need to feed them, therefore you steal from things to feed them. Stealing is a crime, but is it done out of hate?

Does this third world person love the person he is stealing from?? He may not hate him but he may be doing something worst. He may have no emotion at all for him, He maybe giving him no more thought than a bug.

Not loving someone does not mean he hates them. The thief might have no choice, might feel sad because he or she had to hurt someone else to survive...

Sorry, but I'm not going to discuss euthanasia. I'm going back to the original thesis that all crimes (or most) are hate crimes. Many crimes are committed out of greed, with no thought for or against the victim. Theft is a good example. Some people would say crimes like euthanasia, drug possession, and even prostitution are victimless most of the time. But this is not what Mostly Harmless meant.

What he really meant was, "What's the difference between murdering your wife (to give an example) because you've grown to hate her, and murdering a black person because you hate black people? Aren't they both hate?"

Here's the dilemma. Generally speaking, when a man murders his wife this does not inspire a rash of copycat crimes where other husbands murder their wives. Nor, for that matter, are the police likely to be slow in arresting the husband because they agree on some level with the husband's motives. Nor are all wives in the area likely to fear for their own lives, prompting them to act differently and feel differently than they would otherwise.

Perhaps "hate crimes" is a stupid phrase. I think so. It doesn't at all describe what is really going on. Studies on prejudice have repeatedly shown that when a few people single out a minority for ill treatment, the bad treatment will increase if other members of the society (especially authority figures) do not step forward with their disapproval. Racism and homophobia thrive in silence, because the perpetrators like to pretend their actions are socially condoned.

Hate crimes legislation serves two purposes. First, it sets up a formal accounting system for the police so they must report on the number of crimes committed purely for the purpose of singling out minority groups for ill treatment. While compiling the statistics, they may notice a pattern. If so, they can anticipate and stop future crimes. This would not be the case with a random husband killing his wife, to go back to the example earlier. The police may be able to patrol an ethnic neighborhood or a gay hangout, and they might arrest the next criminal before the worst has happened.

The second purpose is to send a social message that society and its authorities do not condone criminal actions that single out minorities. While this message does nothing to help the victim, it is a powerful tool in preventing copycat crimes. I can understand the feeling that doubling jail sentences and so forth is an unnecessarily harsh way to send this message, and in fact I wish we did not do this because it can provoke retaliation. But I do believe we should have hate crimes laws for the purposes of compiling statistics, and issuing social messages to would-be copycat criminals.

Hi Frood and Fragilis,

Welcome to my home page and thank you for replying to my discussion. I at work right now, I have read your replies and visited your home pages. I will try to craft a reply during my lunch hour, but now I have to work. I did find you replies most interesting and look forward to discussing it further.

I love that people from all over the world and different options can discuss subjects like this. It's a great learning exprience.

Talk to you later,

Mostly

P.S. Oh Fragilis, I love redheads.

Frood, I don't know your hair colour.

Well, Mostly, you'll always have Tahni.

Fragilis,

Why do you think she is my favorite desktop pet.

Frood,

I'm sorry but I cannot see were you would have no choice. Growing up in the US and in a rural area there was many choices that you could make before stealing food to survive. There were the government agencies, the local churches that would give help even if you did not go to that church, and the land itself provided wild game that you could trap and eatable plants. I truly grew up in a land of plenty and I try to conserve it so my family never faces what you are talking about. (yes, I am one of those environmental nuts)

I've sat here looking at this reply for several minutes trying to wrap my mind around it. The only thing I can relate it to is the Ethiopian people were their government is hostile towards them, there are few if any churches, and the land has been ravaged by drought. And I would have to agree that if you have no other choices you could steal to survive. But you wouldn't steal for those you love, you would steal from those you hate or worse, those that you have no emotions for, those that you have no regard for.

Quick tangent, I believe that having no emotions, no feels at all for someone is worse than hating them. At lest if you hate them you have some regard for them. The Nazis were able to kill all those people not because they hate them but because regarded them as less than human.

I look forward to your reply,
Mostly

First of all, my hair is brown

Now, the US is a developed country. The government is quite rich and can afford to help the poorer people. But there are many countries where that either cannot be afforded or, even worse, it is stole by corrupt people. So, even if some people get food either by churches, the government, or international help, some will be left out.
I do believe that those that steal wouldn't think nothing of those they stole off. I doubt that someone would think nothing of the person they stole off. (Well, maybe a thief that does not NEED to steal.) It might not be love or hate, but it would probably not be nothing.

And Fragilis, I agree with you. Lots of racism and homophobia (a lot of homophobia where I live) occurs because people feel everyone is in favor of that.

Hi Fragilis,

I really enjoyed your response, it made me think. I will have to agree with what you said. If the police and judges were doing thier jobs and getting the murders, rapist, and thieves off the streets then we wouldn't need the "hate crimes" laws.

The problem that I have with hate crimes is it puts a crime against one group of people over another. Take for example the church burning a few years ago. During a period of time there had been 38 "black Churches" burned and they were labeled hate crimes (and I believe there was no love in these crimes) but during the same amount of time there was 42 "white Churches" and they were not labeled as a hate crime. Just because the victim is black,gay,.... doesn't mean the Crime was racually motivated.

I understand that there is racism and sexism and homophobia in the world. But I guess that I'm idealist enough to think that you should treat everybody as a person. If you must hate someone, just get to know them. I sure you can find a acceptable and personal reason to hate them that has nothing to do with thier colour, religion, sexual prefence,...


Thanks for your comments,

Mostly

Hi Frood,

I love brunettes too.

Sticky subject isn't it. Why is the crime? Is it greed (I think Fragilis has a good point on this), hate, fear? There is a modern day prophet (for lack of a better term) who wrote "Conversations with God", who wrote that all actions can be traced back to one of two emotions, love and fear. So do people steal, rape, murder, and commit other crimes because of fear? Can we go back to the original posting and substitute fear for hate? I don't know if I agree with this statement, but only by discussing these subjects can we maybe understand them and just maybe correct some of the injustices in the world.

On second thought maybe fear is the reason for some of the crimes, maybe racism and homophobia is a result of fear.

Something to think about,

Mostly

Well, Mostly, erm... I'm a man so I don't think brunette is a correct term

A lot of things can be traced back to those two emotions, greed comes from love of money, for example. And many of the 'hate' crimes do come from fear, xenophobia.

Hi Frood,

According to Webster a brunette is "a person having brown or black hair and usually a relatively dark complexion". So your a brunette. I also am a brunette. Most people in the world are brunettes.

!!BRUNETTES RULE!!

Sorry, way big tangent there.

Mostly

Oh, I thought brunette was for women only.
Well, thanks
And, wait.. isn't that 'hairism'?

LOL