h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I understand why there is a neccesity for non-smoking bars ,and other public places. It does not work well to have partail smoking sections in the same building.

Why can't there be a provision for business ( mainly bars and food places) to apply for a smoking license?
Pay a fee just like business does for liquor license and have it posted as a smoking bar.

I do not know how the UK deals with liquor and/or licenses.

In the US some states have government liquor stores, some counties are totally dry ( no alcohol sales). Here they discuss different city or county rules.
Business would suffer if the customers could cross the street to get their preference.


Only those desiring to smoke will go into them and work in them.
It would be a low percentage of bars.
It does not work to have smoking sections and has been proved!

A federal license , apply like other types, be suspended if you allowed under age smoking. Have it be a governemnt smoking bar if neccessary with required good air circulation by the owners.

I think Insurance Companies are now having a larger say in these matters.

Health risks for staff, Fire risks for the building.. plus the extra costs of fitting new ventilation systems..

It is cheaper to make establishments non-smoking now.

Here in Chicago, they have banned all indoor smoking in public places, eliminating all of the smoking sections entirely. I imagine some bars are cheating and allowing it, but they'll run the risk of steep fines or losing their licenses.

Issuing special licenses to allow smoking- and taxing them for the privilege- could work. As you say, the employees would have a choice, as would the patrons. I think that it's especially important that restaurant and bar staff not be exposed to all that second-hand smoke.

Not that I mean to pick on the smokers- used to be one myself.

let smokers kill each other by creating smoke rooms / eating places...
just imagne what the smoke does to your stomach!

after asphalt highway longs you get asphalthighway stomach!

increase smokers healthin surance premiums if has it!

increase smokers fine for littering!

did youknow?
in Japan the goverment has big hand tabacco industry, because of that you will find a lot of tabacco machines on every corner in a city!

Well you can all shout at me if you want but I am A SMOKER! and to tell the truth I believe that this total ban, does in fact infringe MY human rights, which I am entitled to just the same as prisoners have these days!

The Scottish parliament (a joke btw)have passed a law banning it ALL public places, which I feel strongly about

Lets face it, our generation were brought up on nicotine, hells bells, they giving me packets of cigs for free when I was serving in the armed forces doing my bit. Now they want me to stop just like that!

Well sorry government, I am not going to, and I don't feel I should be bullied into it

There, I feel better now

(good subject btw Abbi)
Smudger,

"Issuing special licenses to allow smoking- and taxing them for the privilege- could work. As you say, the employees would have a choice, as would the patrons. I think that it's especially important that restaurant and bar staff not be exposed to all that second-hand smoke."

Exactly PC a few bars that pay (taxes and permits , air circulation)for the privledge of inviting people to smoke in a few establishments. The owners and customers would be paying for the priviledge.

Who would be worse for it?
Nobody is going to have to wander in and breathe smoke.
The smokers are already smoking, some revenue is bound to be gained for the ones allowed to do so.

Yep Pheloxi - the Americans are banning it but still selling their cigarettees elsewhere.

China is a huge market - any country that has not outlawed it.

lil-
If relatively few are allowed , and the expenses covered by the owners, it would not be more expensive in the long run for the *few* business owners.

They would profit by offfering the unusual option. So would the government (healthcare) by collecting taxes and fees for the proviledge. People will smoke or not - a ban just keeps the smokers from spending money in bars.

I never go out to bars or food places anymore so it would not give me any prividges. I think there is room for the option to be given.

I feel I need to stop posting - the large number of writing and spelling mistakes are stressing me out!

*has nicotine patch on*

Three bloody cheers for you Smudger!!!!!

Sod it, smoking is one of the very few means i have of reducing my stress levels, i pay very heavily for this, including massive amounts of tax on every packet, i sincerely doubt that even if i end up with lung cancer or heart disease or whatever, the health costs would exceed the amount i have paid in since the age of 17 on each pack of cigs.

I respect the rights of non smokers & make arrangements to smoke outside if at a non smokers house. If said non smoker comes to visit me, they know it's a smoking household & so have the choice to not visit at all, or put up with it.

As for banning smoking in ALL pubs, bars, public places etc; it is ludicrous. They tried it here in one bar (The Irish bar, which has live music); so everyone was whizzing to & fro through the doors, nobody listening to the music, most people simply gave up after half an hour & the bar was left with about 6 people instead of 200, plus a very pi**ed off group, who had to be paid regardless. After two attempts, lo & behold, smoking is back.

I agree "partitioning" just doesn't work. Separate establishments are the only answer OR the service industry will discover that smokers just won't go out at all & instead there will be more home based entertainment, marginalising society even more. Quelle surprise, smokers die even sooner, 'cos all they can do is stay home & watch TV.

Nicotine is a horribly addictive drug, but tough s**t, it's been around a long time. Volunteers from the anti smoking lobby to go into the rainforests & stop the Indians smoking? And let's not forget, entire African nations depend on tobacco growing for their revenue; unfortunately, their second cash crop tends to be sugar, which is also "verboten". Ah well, they can always turn to growing opium i suppose....

zdt

hands abbi a chair with relaxing massage points...

plays lullabies...

*passes her a ciggie....

zdt

Well said, Terri. I agree that the amount smokers pay in tax is probably what's keeping Britain's health service afloat. On the other hand, banning smoking is only taking away people's human right to be antisocial. (I speak as someone who's allergic to it.) There should also be a heavy tax on perfume, since a lot of people don't seem to know when to stop with that stuff. Have they no sense of smell? How do they even manage to breathe with that noxious cloud following them around?

Ah! Cheers for the support Terri!
I am sick of folk telling me what I can & cant do, I know for a fact that when the ban does come into force next month, that at least half of the pubs here in Kirkcaldy will shut down

I had to stop drinking (which I used to really enjoy)due to my medication, and I am bloody sure I am not going to stop smoking as well

The way things a re going with this P/Correctness, they will be taxing sex next, or telling us that its bad for our hearts (but what a way to go Eh! )

The smoking ban here in Scotland, is a TOTAL ban in ALL pubs, not like in England where if the pub does not sell food, they can allow smoking?
Smudger,

** I am sick of folk telling me what I can & cant do **

Smudger and Terri
your complained stinks as much as your smoking!

I am to angry to say anything else, because all my current thoughts will be seen as bad choice of words or bad language, which is out of charracter.

in loving memory of my dad (63) who died 10 years ago 10 days after he had heard he had long and liver cancer.

I will post now before I get urge to post my anger!

I lost both my parents in the same year pheloxi so I know how you feel, however I was only posting my personal thoughts on the matter of this thread, and never thought that my posts would cause offence

As there are always two sides to every topic that is raised on here, and I thought the point was to discuss them
Smudger,

I am sick of hearing about smokers human rights, what about mine? I want the right to go out without breathing in others smoke, which research has just shown is more poisonous than car exhausts. I want the right to go out and socialise without having problems breathing for at least a week afterwards. Everytime a smoker says tough s**t or whinges about their human rights, I am left speechless by their selfishness, I have a lung infection right now and its making my asthma worse, walking past smokers hurts, but all those going on about human right sdo not care about that.

You do not care about the fact your smoking physically hurts me. I once said that I could never be friends with a smoker and I let that slide, but my rule is back. Anyone who thinks their human right to smoke is worth seeing me in pain for is no friend of mine.

As for smoking outside my house and then coming back in, who are you kidding? I had a 'friend' do that and they came back in stinking of it, we still ended up coughing, our flat still stank and that 'friend' never came back. Don't you realise the stink stays, it doesn't magically disappear just because you have stopped puffing.

As for Indians smoking, they smoke pure tobacco, having been around pure tobacco cigs, I know there is a huge different between them and the usual cig filled with additives. Maybe you smokers should do some research and instead of whinging about Indian tobacco, maybe you should be smoking that instead.

Just because cigarettes have been around for a long time, it doesn't make them right. Murder has been around for a long time, so has incest, religious persecution etc etc, doesn't make them right either.

I am really looking forward to going into bars and clubs which become non-smoking, and if that means the smokers don't go into them anymore, then I was miss their stench. Its my human right not to have my health threatened by your hobby, if you cared you would use one of the many ways of taking tobacco which doesn't put out smoke, but at the end of the day smokers don't care about their health or other peoples health, just their own 'human right'.

The whole point we are trying to make is that we evil people do NOT wish to inflict smoking upon you, so would much prefer to have our own establishments where it is accepted that smoking is happening, therefore people who are affected by/object to such behaviour can completely avoid such places.

This system would ensure that at least people are free to choose, rather than this "halfway house" which does nothing except upset both sides.

I reserve the right to smoke within my own house, just as meat eaters reserve the right to eat dead animals in their house. If invited for a meal at a carnivore household, i will state i am vegetarian & if necessary bring my own food, but if served veggie food from a pan i know full well has been previously used for cooking meat, i have to temporarily withhold my principles in order to enjoy the company of the other people, who have different rules to me.

The only other answer is to stay locked up alone in your own home; or maybe work on the technology to establish a separate planet. Allergies are a horrible thing; animal fur being a prime example, i always tell people i smoke & have a cat; she lives here & is not getting booted out for visitors; but they have a right to know about possible allergens.

Can do very little about pollen in the hay fever season though; so i just snufle & sneeze as i have all my life, other than chopping down all pollen bearing plant life, i just have to put up with it.

Agree 100% on the heavy perfume stuff, also personally when someone peels an orange i am reduced to running off & vomiting, but i can hardly demand a ban on oranges can i?

zdt*nasty evil person*

This country would die if nobody smoked. Very sad, but true.

http://www.new-agri.co.uk/01-1/countryp.html

zdt

Agreed Terri.
That was the whole point I intended to put forth.
*sigh*