h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

The shop example could be done as either a pre-test or post-test, using either "repeat ... until total=pressed" or "while not(total=pressed) ... endwhile". mentioning the destinction might be a good idea, as it lets you mention both types with the same example.

The links for those interested:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/guide/A520895 - PSG version
http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/guide/A533864 - BBS version


PSG - it's interesting that you say "The point is looking at programming loops within the area of programs, NOT looking at programming loops in the area of life." because ....

2 of my 3 examples - bank cashpoint and bank statement print are examples to the layman of how the programs might be working.

Meanwhile

2 of your 3 examples - buying sweets, finding a house in a street have no computers involved, just people.

Anyway I think we have differing styles, so maybe there isn't much more mileage to be gained. Personally I think my entry would go as a very nice introduction into yours. Sort of the best of both worlds

I leave it with you.

BBS

Well, I don't really think either quite hits the mark. Perhaps I should create my own entry !

BBS. I think your entry is a little bit brief. You could also mention that variations of loops allow you to check the condition at the beginning or end of the loop (important because the latter guarantees that the loop code will be executed at least once). You could also mention some of the keywords which are often associated with these loops. I think you can do that without getting into too many specifics.

PSG. I think you could describe the functions of loops without writing lines of pseudo-code and having things like 'goto 3'. I also think that you should explain what a loop is first. Loops with conditions at the beginning and end are just variations on a basic conditional loop and could be treated as sub-types. I'm afraid I particularly don't like your example of a loop at the beginning as it should really be written as a condition at end (the code would be simpler). I don't understand the phrase "you can only access the code in the loop if a condition is true". Surely what you mean is the code in the loop is only executed if a condition is true. Likewise "it is part of the program". All code is part of the program.

Neither of you has addressed the generic loop of iterating over a series of values (of which the counting loop is just a specific example). These loops are represented in various languages with 'for' or 'foreach', but the key point is that they allow iteration over something other than a simple index. In MS VBA, you can iterate over a collection and in perl, you can iterate over the keys of a hash.

It is now clear to me that this entry could get bogged down impossibly.
If we as a group cannot agree on the best, all things considered, entry. Even if it is slightly inperfect, then there will be no definition. which I feel will be more detrimental than an inperfect, and therefore human (as nothing is truely perfect) entry.
So, in short, clear, bullet points rather than sentances, please put down what you feel the perfect entry will be. And then it can be debated clearly.

Researcher PSG

A possible example of divide and conquer recursion in rl:

How to get something done in a large beauracracy (sp?):

You've just been given some work to do:

If you're not the tea boy, split the job into 2 smaller bits, and give one bit to each of your subordinates.
When they've both returned the finished work to you, put the bits back together.
Give the finished work back to whoever gave you the job.

If you are the tea boy, do it yourself, then give the finished work back to whoever gave you the job.

A nice little programming loop in BASIC is:

10 PRINT "This program is silly."
20 GOTO 10

Hello!
It's been a while, but I have had a bit of a think.

To the Moderators:
Please remove this conversation from peer review, I have decided to withdraw the entry from consideration.

To everyone who has contributed to this conversation:
Thanks for your input, I have decided to set up a University of Life project on An introduction to Programming, and I have just been approved. There should be a link on the current projects page in due course.
If any of you would like to help on the project I would be glad of the help and input.

Researcher PSG

Actually, it is scouts who do removals, not moderators - I'll see what I can do about getting it moved...