h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Good for you. And sorry for not sympathizing.

Personally, i would tell him to "stop being such a wan*er and just leave me the f**k alone" myself.

This was just said in reference to me:

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Response from friends was not what I'd expect from a friend. At best I was made to sound like I didn't know any better. Gee thanks.

You guys don't like this person either. Yet you pander to him and let him be insulting to someone that I thought you did like. without saying a word.


Am going to bed.

F**k this sh*t. Who needs it.

Actually, Az, that was said about you AND me, and I was about to post it. I hope you saw my suitably irate reply.
"May I ask other contributors to actually think before querying what is said by people whom you already know to be knowledgeable"... what a scumbag.

previous posting from scumbag,

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Noggin said:
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Oh, poor ole az. Just too stupid for you lot, right? And you, Noggin, not a word to the scumbag about this obvious rudeness? Aren't I your friend?

Obviously somewhat delusional here. Thought I had friends.

bye,
az

I have to agree with Fnord here, pointlessly belittling a blameless, intelligent person is to be deplored. And I am repeatedly sorry for the somewhat callous way in which I replied. I value your opinions and did not mean to insult you.



I didn't know the history. I will try to be more sensitive in future.

hi Clare,


<<. . .it is indeed rather different from feeling god is *with* you and *believing* in him (or her or whatever) because of that. I do wonder though, whether other people may have had similar sensations, but took them to mean that god was with them, rather than was them. Just a thought.>>

I don't know many people who actually say 'I am god' because, well, that does sound a bit weird unless you know what is meant by that. Though Moth and the Pagans on the God-fact or fiction thread also say that there is no difference between themselves and their gods.

I think that 'believing' in a god is quite different from feeling that you and god are one. And most religions are structured to separate one from god - to keep god at a distance to be worshipped. I wonder if most people are just more comfortable with this set-up, having god 'with' them rather than 'being' god.

az

(sounds like a good name for a band - Moth and the Pagans )

Roadkill,

Up off your knees, lad! I didn't even notice you being 'callous'.

Anyhow, I'm over it. Though it did help to get some support from my friends on that thread. This morning scumbag had to totally back down, though he didn't apologise. Tried to blame it on cheap vodka. Hohum.

Must go to work now. See you later,
az

Excellent. Glad to see you got through it.

All this talk about God being (with) you is confusing me, being a buddhistist atheist an' all.

God has to be something. Let's call it a unifying force. So God today is for me the unifying force that is survival. A religion based on survival is not a nice one. Sure it worked in the frontier times and it was practically necessary to keep the peasants governing themselves, but it's unnecessary in this side of the world in this time. Or so I pointed out in my RE GCSE paper.

A unifying forced called . . . Fred!

az

I'd rather call it "Stupid". Heheh- this old classic with a modern twist just occured to me -
"What do you call the Christian God? Anything you like - it doesn't exist to hear you!" Hahahah! Ahahahah! Ahaa-aw.

(sigh)

hilarious

It wasn't that unfunny! Sob... Hang on... . None of them worked, did they?

Only the one.

I think I prefer,

God: "I don't question *your* existence."

Azahar,

Or else?

Sorry not very good at finishing your sentences are we, I assume you can finish a sentence... or is this a threat? Okay, your bluff is called so you now have to "or else" me.

Plus I'm sure Clare can speak for herself, so I'll cut you a deal, I'll be more polite and you cut out the threats and aggression - okay?

A fashion designer threatening an ex-army engineer, not a good idea. No need to apologise.

Cranky? Do you have idea how banal it is to trawl through the ramblings offered on many of these sites? It is supposed to be the H2G2, not a twenty-somethings chatroom. "Hey yeah hi, azahar, oh hi, yeah, long time no see......." and you expect to want me to read that? Where does the learning come from that?

The whole basis of christianity is the resurrection of a man and his subsequent passing into heaven; without that the whole basis of the trinity, Jesus being the son of god etc. etc. is gone; therefore christianity should be declared as bunkum. The miracles are the hooks used to attract the young and naive into the world of wonder. Take out the miracle and Jesus of Nazareth is a bit boring to a 6 or ten year old. Get 'em young and you keep for life!

With the institution of the church being intrinsically linked into the culture and governmental policy of so many countries across the globe then the consequences of this are so far reaching that the fabric of society would crumble - have you not noticed how powerful the christian right is in the US of A, have you not noticed how many countries have political parties called the Christian Democrats? We all 'laugh' at the word antidisestablishmentarianism but has one actually thought about what the consequences would be should the disestablishmentarists get their way? If Jack Straw got up tomoorow and declared that state support for the Church was being withdrawn; schools would close, churches would be demolished or converted into yuppie flats, communities would lose their focal point, the Health service would further hiccup and so much more. But it won't happen - apart from sprouting nonsenese the church is too intrinsic to our quotidian lifestyles. You may think that the fabric of society has been frayed, no where near, I've seen it with my own eyes. I'm talking about outright anarchy, streets being patrolled by armoured Land-Rovers (Belfast), mass graves in the hillsides (Bosnia / Kosovo), playing football with the heads of your enemy (Rwanda).

Before you and others declare me a cranky atheist read on....

Many people use the word "atheist" too liberally, it is not a person who does not believe in God, it is a person who does not believe in anything, a true atheist does not believe in anything not even a moral code and this is where I took dispute with Douglas Adams over the term "radical atheist" (see "Salmon of Doubt".) DNA had a very strong moral code and should not describe himself as an extreme atheist.

I do believe in a moral code, I also believe that a right and just set of principles can be instilled in people without resorting to legends , myths and folklore of some bloke who was nailed to a cross two thousand years ago.

Actually I do believe that a bloke called Jesus was strapped by leather straps to a cross (not nails - too early for them) for being of "a rebellious nature against the pharisees" and this 'hero of folklore's' story has been corrupted over the years (as it was passed from camp fire to camp fire, from congregation to congregation) and has been re-written to suit other people's purposes (ha-ha - the Spanish Inquisition). The story of the resurrection is not uncommon - in about 50AD we know of about six gods / demi-gods who died and came back to life (Bacchus, Adonis, Osiris, Mithras, Dionysus and the green man,) and many religions adopted the belief that if you followed your god (and did as the establishment told you) then you would die and be re-born - "so why not", thought early christians, "use the resurrection as an enticement to get people on our side against the Romans?" (before anybody has a go at me for not reading the bible, may I suggest they re-read Acts, Letters and Revelations from the viewpoint of an anti-roman rebel).

Finally - why only four gospels? Whatever happened to the other's like the gospel of Thomas? They were taken out by the early christians because they were anti-church!

By the way do you know where the re-born stuff comes from? From trees! You see to a "relatively uneducated in the realms of science" chap two thousand years ago it must have been puzzling as to why trees seemingly died and then came back to life again the following and if a tree could do it, why couldn't a man? After all man, thinks one man arrogantly, can build bridges and viaducts and can launch armies across the seas so why can't he come back to life after it dies like a tree?

I pity Christians who say silly things like "well he doesn't believe in God, so he'll burn in hell" - and that isn't loony extremists, that's quite a few middle of the road englishers who utter that twaddle or other twaddle such as "you can't go out with her you're a non-christian". So unembracng and judgemental, these christians, so hypocritical, so out of touch with the modern, cosmopolitan world.


I also believe in staying firmly within advocacy, not resorting to adhomony, but by heck it was difficult when someone uses the word "nice" to describe me.

Anyway I'm off now to kill my father for working on a sunday (he's a surgeon) and to cook a beef roast as ("the odour doth pleaseth the lord")....well that's what it commands in the bible and we all know what's written in there is the be all and end all.

Bye Esplen

'Many people use the word "atheist" too liberally, it is not a person who does not believe in God, it is a person who does not believe in anything, a true atheist does not believe in anything not even a moral code and this is where I took dispute with Douglas Adams over the term "radical atheist" (see "Salmon of Doubt".) DNA had a very strong moral code and should not describe himself as an extreme atheist.'

Where do you get this meaning of atheist from? Is not a theist someone who believes in god (from greek theos)? 'a' is a common negative suffix, as in amoral, having no marals, and asymmetrical, no symmetry. I don't know what the word for 'not believing in anything' is, but I don't think it's atheist.

We've grown up a lot since your last post haven't we? Before we were silly little teenagers, now we're twenty-somethings .

'Plus I'm sure Clare can speak for herself' I can, as a matter of fact, but I'm glad I have friends who will also stand up for me thanks guys!

At the risk of sounding like someone in a twentysomethings' chatroom, lighten up a bit Esplen. We're not out to get you. Really.

Esplen,

Well, hello again Mr. No Visible Sense of Humour. Obviously I was not 'threatening' you. I was being funnily ironic and sticking up for Clare because she is my friend and I like her very much (hi Clare!). Well, okey-dokey then, shall cut out my 'threats and aggression' Meanwhile, I think it *will* be very nice if you start being more polite. It might even be nicer for you!

But I still stand by calling you 'cranky' and shall add 'seriously defensive' to that. (and anyhow, I never called you a cranky athiest, just cranky ) Boy, you sure a bee in your bonnet about Christians. Sounds like you have had some nasty experiences with the fundamentalist sort. Since Jem has left us (I hope only temporarily) I don't think you'll find anyone else on this thread who takes the Christian myth literally. Though even Jem was very far from being a fundamentalist, in fact she got on this thread to try and sort out exactly what her feelings about her religion were. She is very open minded, as the rest of us are.

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I don't expect you to read anything at all if you don't want to. Also there are thousands of different threads here. And some of them do end up being more like semi-personal chats between two or more people. So? If you happen onto one of those then stop reading and go on to something else that you find more interesting. Sheesh.

Although I was brought up (so to speak) as Roman Catholic, I left all that behind many many years ago. But later on doing reading on comparative religion and mythology I realised that the Christian religion, like all others, have some good things to say. It is not religion per se that causes so much havoc and misery in the world, it's the people controlling the religions and governments. Almost all religions are political, after all.

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Yes well, perhaps I was mistaken by using that particular adjective for you? Sorry, can't seem to help it. Being Canadian (we're all nice, doncha know?) I may have just been projecting.

Anyhow, Esplen, I agree with Clare. Try to lighten up a bit. I'm sure that would feel quite (oops, almost said nice) good. You are among friends here if you would like to be.

az

The word for someone who doesn't believe in anything is 'nihilist'.

A religion is a sort of worldview that informs a set of social and personal practices (or vice versa). As such it operates on a lot of different levels; empirical, social, political, psychological, moral, metaphysical, which are cooked together with unspoken assumptions and symbolisms in a way that makes disentangling them virtually impossible. Religion becomes dangerous when it combines unreflective literalism with an "us and them" outlook.


Noggin

nihilist. That's a nice word Sounds a bit like someone sneezing though.

Theist, atheist and agnostic all come from Greek, but nihilist from Latin. Maybe we could call it an oukist or something . Not that it really matters I suppose. In the real world.
(sigh)