h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Just one line in this otherwise excellent Entry bugs me: "...Alternatively, they may remain in a wasteland of general disbelief indefinitely".
That does seem like a very negative way to describe a state of healthy scepticism. Having observed some of the things that are done in the name of religion, and the insane things some people can persuade themselves to believe, I'll take the "wasteland" any day.

Some agnostics do indeed feel they are in a "wasteland of disbelief." Elie Wiesel is a good example of this phenomenon. A devout Jew thrust into the Holocaust, Wiesel has won the Nobel Peace Prize for his books and lectures.

Wiesel wrote in part about how the tragedy (which was both very personal for him and simultanously far-reaching) made him feel he had little choice but to abandon his earlier beliefs. His book "Night" is a must-read for understanding how a deeply religious person can become agnostic as the result of a tragedy.

Obviously, not all agnostic people feel this way. Even among those who were once religious, many feel their beliefs are perfectly healthy. I attempted to give several different examples of agnostics to give an idea of the breadth of opinion they hold. I felt it would be inappropriate (and impossible) to describe every agnostics' inner feelings and opinions.

I feel that if you read the entire list of 'reasons' for agnosticism while understanding that each person is of course different, you will get a broad idea of what to expect from agnostics. I'm sorry you felt otherwise.

Fair enough, Fragilis. You're right, the piece does describe a wide range of aspects of agnosticism, and I can well appreciate how someone who once had a firm faith and lost it might deeply mourn the loss. On reflection, perhaps that line I objected to is valid.
I myself occasionally envy true religious believers; it must be so comforting to have that kind of unquestioning certainty in your life. But when I feel like that, I just check out a fundamentalist Christian website or two. I find that they soon make me glad to be my sceptical self.

I really appreciate your understanding, Ormondroyd. I feel we are both right. Perhaps the article is and is not correct, in the same way that agnostics are certainly unsure.

I too sometimes envy religious believers -- and atheists as well. But if I try to be like them, I find I become surly and obsessive rather than comforted or confident. To each their own, I suppose.

The prevalence of religion for thousands of years, and the fact that people are even now killing one another in its name, shows a human need for religious belief so deep that it might be called a basic drive. I think that, once our species rose to a certain level of awareness, it had to develop a system of acceptable irrationality in order to dope with the terrors of "life, the universe, and everything". While most people in the UK now appear to be agnostic, consider how strongly many of them hang on to irrational belief systems such as "My football team is best" or the "Germans all ncik the sunbeds".

The prevalence of religion for thousands of years, and the fact that people are even now killing one another in its name, shows a human need for religious belief so deep that it might be called a basic drive. I think that, once our species rose to a certain level of awareness, it had to develop a system of acceptable irrationality in order to dope with the terrors of "life, the universe, and everything". While most people in the UK now appear to be agnostic, consider how strongly many of them hang on to irrational belief systems such as "My football team is best" or the "Germans all ncik the sunbeds".

The prevalence of religion for thousands of years, and the fact that people are even now killing one another in its name, shows a human need for religious belief so deep that it might be called a basic drive. I think that, once our species rose to a certain level of awareness, it had to develop a system of acceptable irrationality in order to cope with the terrors of "life, the universe, and everything". While most people in the UK now appear to be agnostic, consider how strongly many of them hang on to irrational belief systems such as "My football team is best" or the "Germans all ncik the sunbeds".

The German's *do* nick all the sunbeds...

{Politically Correct Filter: The trait of doing so is slightly more pronounced among Germans who I've experienced - which is quite a few, given that I've lived there for eight years in total, but obviously is not all, and the sample taken could be unrepresentative. Naturally, this is not a universal case, nor is it necessarily a bad thing, being a consequence of a national tendency towards strictly obeying the letter of rules, one which I am rather fond of}

I don't think people actually *believe* their football team is best. They *support* them, but I disagree that there's the same level of brainwarp going on there.

I think people in the UK are publicly agnostic - whatever their faith is, they don't allow it to affect business things, nor social things. The majority of people in censi still say they are Church of England...

A Bradford City season ticket holder writes: I have for some time now accepted that football is my substitute for religion. It fulfils, in a generally harmless way, that basic primeval urge to ditch reason every now and again and just have heartfelt, irrational FAITH.

Consider the parallels: come the Sabbath/match day, you put on the appropriate trappings to reflect your sense of tribal belonging. (Sunday best or replica shirt/scarf). Then you go to a place of worship (temple/stadium) where you join a congregation and sing songs that express your faith. You fervently insist that your faith shall triumph over the infidel (even if, deep down, you're not so sure).

You sing songs of adulation to the Messiah/your lot's latest star. You praise, or in times of crisis denounce, the high priest/head coach. And if your prayers/chants are answered, then lo, your spirits are lifted unto the heavens. And if they aren't, then you are cast down into the long post-defeat inquest of the soul.

And yea, though we walk in the Valley of the Shadow of Relegation, yet shall we fear no evil... ( appears and leads Ormondroyd away).

I would agree that some people do have an inner drive to have faith in *something.* However, I would argue that not all people are like this. I can't think of a single thing that I have irrational faith in, for instance. (I might, of course, have 'faith' that the street light will turn red eventually, as it always does.)

I would agree that God need not be the thing someone has faith in. Sports teams are a good choice. But even there, you can see the effects of rabid worship. There are occasionally injuries or even deaths when arguments between 'sports team believers' erupt. And here in Denver, we had riots in the street when the locals celebrating winning the football season a couple of years back. These only got worse when we won the hockey championship the following year.

I suppose my favorites are the people who have faith in fuzzy things like human nature, or optimism about the future. These folks are usually relatively harmless, and at worse will be a bit miffed if things go horribly bad.

Believe me, I know how ugly sports support can get - although, thankfully, my soccer club has a pretty peaceful following that tends to keep out of trouble most of the time. I don't necessarily RECOMMEND sports support as a substitute for religious faith, although it seems to work quite well for me. I merely meant to point out the psychological similarities between the two.