h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

We've been hit by the CSA. They want more than we can afford. We might end up losing the house. We might end up bankrupt.

I feel like the drowning man. I just get my head above water and think about swimming for the shore. Then along come the CSA, and tread on my head.

Christmas has just been shattered.

WTF is the CSA?

Canadian Standards Association?

Never give the b******s what they want, it only makes 'em greedier.

Have a

And a

Hope it works out..

CSA is the Child Support Agency. They regulate (HA) the maintenance payments for absent parents. They are also well known for favouring the parent with custody, and many people have been bankrupted or committed suicide due to their totally unreasonable demands.

Now they've hit us for my 2 stepkids, and the amount they want will literally ruin us. Even if we appeal, we still have to pay the full amount whilst the appeal is heard.

And the worst thing is, the money won't even go to the children, as their mother doesn't work, so it goes to the state.

And there's absolutely nothinng I can do.

Thanks for the though!

for you too!

Damn. Is there no family advocate who could mediate? I realise lawyers are generally useless, but perhaps you could seek an appointment with a family court judge, purely for advice..

There has to be a solution

In the meantime, have another , my friend.

I wish there was. Unfortunately, our government, in its wisdom, decided to make the CSA all powerful. Not even the courts can influence their decisions.

The problem is that the old system used to take individual cases on their own merits, but now it's basically a rote formula, with minimal leeway for circumstances. They have left us with free income of about £50 per week, and fail to realise that we have 2 kids of our own and also pay £40 per week in petrol costs for commuting. How the hell am I supposed to feed and clothe a family of 4 on that?

They just don't care that we are paying for all the debts from my hubby's first marriage, and also that when the ex walked out, she stripped the house bare and left him with nothing. So she gets off scot free and debtless, with a house full of furniture. We get landed with the debts, replacing the furniture (I paid for it all) and paying way to much maintenance.

Now the kids want expensive trainers, tracksuit, computer games, etc, for christmas. We tried to explain, but all we got was "well, mum's broke too, so you should buy us them" They're teenagers. Typical.


for Tal

Gaa. What a bunch of [I won't say it, ok moderators?]

Are there any other families you know facing the same pig-headedness? You might get together a group and try to work out a strategy?

The Family Services here in BC operated much in the same high-handed manner for years, and only recently has come under concerted attack from parents for similar unfair decisions. I don't know all the details, but I could find some stuff out for you if you wish. Although we're in different countries, there may be some ideas that you could adapt..

I understand only too well the problems of dealing with an entrenched bureaucracy... once they have decided something, it takes a divine act to divert them to a different course.

Maybe you should send the kids down to the CSA offices...

Oh, and do you have debt counsellors there? Here such services are provided free. If you are indeed facing bankruptcy, you could consider going to a debt counsellor, who would contact all those to whom debts are owed, to arrange a payment schedule that you could handle. And don't let on to the CSA, or they might 're-evaluate' you again..

Anyway, have another , and a too..

We really only have 2 outstanding debts...one we just took out a few months back to replace the windows, and one remaining from his marriage. Neither of them are willing to negotiate, both would rather just take us to court if we default. The big worry is the mortgage, and the possibility of having the house repossessed. Our mortgage company are a thieving shower of s, and they have a habit of losing info sent to them, even if sent recorded delivery.

There are hundreds of people in our situation. It's made headlines in all the major newspapers over the years. Mainly because of the high suicide rate. The CSA was originally supposed to chase absent parents who refused to pay support. Instead, they would rather slam the parents who they know about.

So many have tried to fight them, and everyone fails. Its a lose-lose situation, I'm afraid. And even if I try to find a job, and sort out childcare, etc, they would only take my wages into consideration, and force us to pay even more.

It wouldn't be so bad, but here in the UK, if the person receiving the support is unemployed and on welfare, the support goes direct to the state. So we are paying out, and it's not even going to benefit the children we're paying for.

Dealing with them is like banging your head against a brick wall...all you get is a thumping great headache.

Thanks for the support, it's nice to know someone cares!

Damn again...

I know very little about such matters even here in Canada, but do you have such things as second mortgages there? You could try the debt counsellor route, get a recommendation to another mortgage company, consolidate and have a reduced payment schedule. Depending on the housing situation, you might find another company willing to assume the mortgage. If not, it may be possible to compel your current mortgage company to accept reduced payments, at least for a short term. For this, you would definitely require the services of a debt counsellor.

Another thing you could do is start contacting others in the same situation, create a support/lobby group, get a member of parliament interested, get some medical professionals involved, (psychiatric and psychology professions for example).

Do you have such things as class action suits? I suppose the CSA is immune to such things In any case, it sounds like you need some kind of advocate, legal, and/or political.

I wish I could offer more than moral support and virtual s..

I'm so sorry, Mistdancer. That's abominable. The money doesn't even go to the children? Excuse me? What sort of crap is that? You and your husband don't want/can't get custody, but because their mum doesn't work, the money goes into a fund for them, or for kids in general? I'm just trying to take in how this is supposed to *help* the kids. If I could see it doing that, maybe there would be something here besides How to Make Families Go Bankrupt -- and no doubt bankruptcy would cost the house, but the CSA payments are exempt, just as all parental payments are here, from any sort of dodge -- except you accumulate debt to the state, and the state pays them for you, while you do actual jail time for non-payment of child-support. The state charges interest.

What has the word 'child' got to do with this agency?

Bewildered, and sorry to hear this.

~Silent Lucidity~

Hi Silent, thank you for visiting.

The way it works is this. If the custodial parent is unemployed and receiving benefits from the state, then they will not get any of the moneys paid in child support by the non custodial parent. The money is taken by the state to pay towards the benefits, leaving them no better off.

The current system uses a standard formula for calculating the rates of support to be paid, and this is incredibly inflexible. Many fathers (and non custodial mothers) have been bankrupted, and some have even been driven to suicide, by this.

The biggest problem I have with this is that whilst my stepchildren are no better off, my natural children are going to suffer. My youngest is 6 months old, and costs a fortune in nappies and baby formula alone. Not to mention the clothes he keeps growing out of.

And also, the formula includes an amount for the ex-wife. Why should we pay to support an adult who is fully capable of supporting herself, should she choose to?

And throughout all of this, the ex and her family constantly put pressure on the stepchildren to be as difficult as possible towards us. It's upsetting for them, as they still love their dad, and they like me, but they are being pressured at home. We haven't tried for custody, as the children want to stay with their mother. They are teens, so they are old enough to choose for themselves.

I just wish there was a way out, but I really can't think of one right now. I guess I'm just going to have to see if I can cost cut some more. I can see me and hubby living off beans on toast for some time yet.

Thank you again for caring. It helps to know people do.

Mistdancer, sorry to hear about the trouble with the csa, they really are a total bunch of B******S. from what you've said in other replies it sounds like your assessment is wrong, you said that you've been left with £50 but this is below the income support rate for a single person, and the formula should allow you a lot more than that. you can request a meeting with a "face to face" officer from csa, for him/her to explain how the assessment was calculated, this helped me find the errors in my assessment and get them corrected. also you can request a complete computer printout of everything they have about you and this can be another good way of finding errors (data protection act). also have you applied for working families tax credit, it can be worth over £100/week and may help.

* Mark *

Oolon, we're trying for WFTC at the moment, so I'll let you all know if we are successful! We're also querying the assessment, but I'm terrified to rock the boat too much in case they up the payments instead of lowering them

The £50 is supposed to pay for food, clothes, school dinners, baby formula/nappies, petrol, etc. How???? You're right, if it wasn't for the mortgage and the bloody debts we got stuck with, we'd be better off on the dole.

Willem...*Mark*???? I'm confused. BTW..nice to see you! I've seen the WLC about, and what you're all doing is a really nice thing. Have a , you probably need one right about now.

aargh, the CSA is not worked out very well.

Being on the receiving end of my ex husbands, it works very well for me, but he is still single, and lives with his mum. He sometimes complains to my mother that because I 'rip so much away from him' he can't afford a flat of his own. On further enquiries, it seems he can't afford it, as he has too many loans, and nothing to do with me.

But I was also the partner of someone who had a child by another woman, and I saw the forms from his side. I refused to let him tell them about me, as they seemed to want to take my earnings into account! Oh yeah, like I work for HIS kid to have all my cash when I have a kid of my own! Luckily, although he lived with me, he still had his own house, so he got all the mail sent there.

Now we have split up, and I hear that they are stitching him up no end. Although I have to say that I think it's his fault, as his pride made him tell them that he is an employee (which he is) of his own company. So he has to pay out on the basis of what salary the company should be paying him, rather than how much the company has. Which is hovering on the edge of bankruptcy, so he doesn't draw any salary.

As I am on WFTC, at least I get the money my ex husband pays out.
I feel for your situation, and I hope your appeal helps.