h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

I saw a brilliant nature programme this evening about insect eating mammals, the oldest mammals evolutionarily. (And yes it a Dave Attenbrough - but I coped)

There was amazing stuff. One of the strangest being the African pangolin, related to Armadillos, and distantly to hedgehogs...

This is the Pangolin clip from the programme.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btkVS7uYNwM

Effers, I love that clip! What an industrious creature, and so fitted for its lifestyle - and it's quite beautiful in a pangolin-type way...

Vicky

>What an industrious creature<

That's so appropriate as a description. What's also fascinating that David Attenbrough, (DA) showed a fossil of a Pangolin from 50 million years ago. And it was almost identical to the present day ones. It hasn't needed to evolve, because the ants it feeds on, also haven't changed in 50 million years, they are so well adapted to their environment. The same goes for most insect eating mammals.

On the programme, which I couldn't find a clip for, DA, also shows these amazing bats in NZ, living in the original forest, that used to cover the vast majority of NZ, before Europeans arrived. These bats have re-evolved to spend most of their time on the forest floor, like their ancient ancient shrew ancestors, scrabbling around looking for worms and insects, and fighting with each other over giant crickets etc for food.

Yep you should value your own indigenous fauna, and not be too upset about not having things like foxes and hedgehogs.

But if you ever visit England, I guarantee, you'll get to see foxes. Do you know that ancient Greek saying? 'The hedgehog knows one big thing and the fox, many small things.' The hedgehog just roots around searching out worms, and rolls up into a ball if threatened. The fox is infinitely clever, and has all the tricks in the book to get by.



Hi mikey, too.....

Hi Effers

I'm still here. Very busy and a bit stressed so keeping a low profile!

Hi Vicky

mikey2

Effers

I've planted out my sweat peas. Do you think I need to protect them from frost? The forecast said there was a chance of frost overnight.

mikey

Yes I would.

BTW congratualtions on getting yours to germinate. None of my sweet peas did. I don't understand why. Everything else is doing brilliantly.

I always have a problem with sweet peas.

Did you make sure you planted them into richish soil/compost?

I'm only going on what that garden prog, once said. I seem to have very ungreen fingers when it comes to them.

Thanks Effers

Only 9 of 40 of mine have come up! Mind you, they're a year past their sell-by date. Yes they're in neat compost with half a bag of top-soil thrown in for good measure.

I've just been out watering the vegetables...the spuds are approx. 18 inches tall! The first sowing of peas are 10 inches tall. The beetroot look nearly ready to eat!! I'm totally blown away by it all.

Must go and cover the sweat peas and tomatoes.

mikey

<>

We don't have very much, but what we do have is fascinating - the tuatara, the 'living dinosaur' as it's called, for one. (I've seen them in zoos, they like the kiwis, are in special habitats, where they can be glimpsed if you're lucky!)

But I am fascinated by foxes...

Vicky

Yes they are brilliant..

Mikey I thought I should explain more to you more about the reasons for my reaction to your recent postings on TGD thread - for my own sake.

I find your position on such things as homosexuality very worrying. Worrying because your opinions are not based on any reason. I always worry when people think things based on blind political ideology or religious ideology, with no proper explanation that makes any sense in real life, for thinking the way they do. You say homosexuality is harmful. I think people thinking the way you do, which doesn't involve any real world/life reasons for thinking such things is harmful. I'm not too bothered how they harm themselves. But I'm bothered about the very real pain and unhappiness it can cause other people.Despite my tantrums etc I'm a fairly strong person really, and I can pretty much get over the hurt. I know more vulnerable people can't though. As you know people with attitudes very similar to yours have hurt me personally in my life, because they all got together in a group. They started out with this love the sinner, not the sin thing. But it soon got pretty nasty. The more gentle souls amongst the bornagains were soon steam rollered by the stronger personalities. i can easily put up really with coping with people like you on the internet. It's real life people in my life thinking that way, that are much more of a problem for me.

It's scary stuff as far as I'm concerned that people think the way you do. It ultimately leads to all manner of extremism, as it's not based on anything real in the real world. There's nothing to prevent such attitudes going off in all directions as there's no testing ever being done against *reality*.

Still at least you finally came clean about your views which I had already guessed. And my response to not wanting you on my list seems perfectly fine. Having you there would have been ridiculous really. And being kicked off Effer's friends list is nothing.

I will always stand up to people with views such as yours. I don't believe in endlessly compromising and appeasing. Vicky always knew this and accepted it. You'll have to.

I think just getting on with people for the sake of a peaceful life is very dangerous when it comes to certain things. And it's lessons of history which show us this Be it political or religious ideas based on nothing more than blind faith in an idea.

So I can't respect where you are coming from I'm afraid. i accept your right to hold whatever opinions you want. No-one can control others' minds. But I won't respect those views when I know full well the hurt they lead to in other's lives.

Hearing someone say they love you unconditionally despite your sin of loving another of the same sex is a 'double bind'. If you read any of the psychiatrist R. D. Laing's writings, you would know that 'double bind' is one of the most harmful things you can do to another in human relationships. It wouldn't be healthy for me mentally to interact much with someone who used 'double bind' in terms of 'friendship', even on internet. This is a lesson I find myself having to learn again and again. one day I might just get the message.

So I bid you adieu. Interaction on the TGD thread won't be a problem though.

See you around...

Effers

I feel bad that I've hurt you but I can't pretend I'm something other than what I am. I still think of you as a friend if you change your mind.

Mikey2

Thanks for your reply. It's no use using a '' Mikey. You need to face up to the fact that believing what you do, absolutely, and wanting to be part of such an organisation/church has the potential to hurt other people. This is hard reality, which I'm forever asking faithers to look at. I can assure you that although you have every right to continue to believe the things you do, but there will be consequences in the real world, for you and others.

I'm now unsubbing from this thread.

Effers

Hey mikey, I'm briefly re-subbing, just to check you're okay?

I did leave a post for you a bit like this on TGD thread, but I don't know if you saw it, so I'm leaving another one here.

Feel free to be in touch if you want.

And yes of course, we are still mates, ...

Take care eh, and think about what I put to you on TGD thread, but don't take anything personally, and you know some of the reason for my vehemence was due to the hurt that happened, that still makes absolutely no sense to me; but I don't want to go over any of that again here, please. This is just a friendly check-up thing.

It's been hotter than hell here today and the tomatoes and chilli peppers are doing brilliant.

Mikey I have just re-read what I wrote to you here, and felt I should just re-iterate that I am not changing my stance on *anything* about what I said on TGD thread, including the style and mode of response to my points. This is NO attempt at any compromise. I just wanted you to be totally clear on that.

This is just a friendly check on you, totally out with any of that.

(I felt the need to make this second post because part of the problem is that you seem to sometimes misunderstand or whatever the point I'm making).

I didn't want any more misunderstanding.

Thanks for that, Effers.

I've been absent cos its all been stressing me out. Just popped in to discover 354 postings on TGD!

I'm off to do some walking in the Lake District for a week now....take care.

Mikey

Enjoy your walks, mikey. You can learn much wisdom from listening to what the Nature Gods have to say.