h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

There's a fascinating article on the BBC website this week about pedestrian crossings - specifically, whether pressing the button makes any difference.

Well, it turns out it does, sometimes. But not always. You can read the thing here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23869955

But my interest was piqued by this section:

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"Sometimes the reasons for a non-responsive button are not traffic-related. In 2012 TfL changed the pedestrian setting at Henlys Corner in north London after discussions with the Jewish community.

Orthodox Jews are not allowed to operate electronic machinery on the Sabbath. The change means that from sundown on Friday to sundown on Saturday the pedestrian crossing operates on an automated programme rather than via pressing the button."
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What a fascinating high-tech solution to an anti-tech problem

I read that yesterday. It's an interesting piece.

It still left me with a question though. The article seems to only deal with crossings at junctions, and in those cases it seems to be a largely automated system, and the button has little to no effect.

But, unless I missed it, it doesn't mention crossings in the middle of a long stretch of road. I think there must be an effect on those crossings, because it would disrupt the follow of traffic is they operated for no reason.

Did you see the linked article about the secret button on the bottom?


Geggs

{it doesn't mention crossings in the middle of a long stretch of road....}

I think they are what's called 'standalone' crossings. The article says:

"At a standalone pedestrian crossing, unconnected to a junction, the button will turn a traffic light red."


Just checking that linked article...

Ah right, I did miss it then.


Geggs

whats thre differance between pressing a button, and deliberatly standing in front of a sensor, to operate a crossing.

They don't operate it, of course

I used to work with Muslims. During Ramadan I had to lick postage stamps for them

Better than lickin a camal I suppose but why, is stamp glue a food stuff

I don't think it was the content of the glue. They told me they weren't suppose to touch anything with their mouths.

Personally, I find these fundamentalist restrictions rather inane. It's like grown ups playing "The Floor is Lava!"

Well yes, because to you they don't mean anything. But if someone truly believes that following these rules means something to their god of choice, then they mean a lot.

We can argue from here to next week about whether a god exists, or if he cares that 'his' people lick stamps, but I think those sorts of arguments have been done to death on here.

> whats thre differance between pressing a button, and deliberatly standing in front of a sensor, to operate a crossing.

None, which is why "the pedestrian crossing operates on an automated programme", not a sensor.

TRiG. <-- The geek smiley is appropriate. Orthodox Judaism is *very* geeky. I've been learning a bit about it.

I like that description - being observant IS pretty geeky, come to think of it. Which is not a disrespectful thing to say.

For just about forever, having to deal with practical problems like that on a Sabbath has plagued Jewish communities. That's why they have Gentile friends. When you help observant people out by doing something they aren't allowed to, that makes you the 'shabbes goy', or 'Sabbath foreigner'.

After all, it's not a moral question, it's a ritual one. So if you aren't part of the ritual, it's perfectly legal for you to push the button, lock the door, or reset the thermostat. In return, they'll work on Christmas.

Just don't put your coffee milk in the synagogue's meat fridge. And NEVER order pepperoni pizza delivered to the premises.

Can't find the linked article about a secret button. I'm intrigued.

It's this one

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-ouch-22706881

What a great idea.

Hmmm, have yet to hear from the Jewish community in Stockholm about this problem and yes, there are certain crossings where you only get a green light as a pedestrian if you press the button, but they're few.

Most crossings have a set pattern.

But last summer, there was a lot of roadwork next to a crossing on my way to work, meaning less traffic, so they set the pedestrian lights to sensor.

I felt pretty cool approaching the crossing and having a green light switched on, just for me.

If you are impressed by stopping traffic at a pedestrian crossing, you have obviously never taken a sailboat through the Intercoastal Waterway in the US.

Imagine you have a 30 foot (say 10 metre) high mast and the draw bridges are only 21 feet (say 7 metres) >the conversion is not exact but close enough for my point<

Before you can pass the bridge the draw span must be raised, stopping all the traffic in both directions. The road is closed not only long enough for you to pass but also the time required to raise and lower the bridge.

Now also imagine the bridge has bumper to bumper traffic headed to or from the beach.

Today most of the bridges to and from the beach open at only certain times, usually 4 per hour. The 'pass' bridges between the barrier islands all open on demand whenever someone asks.

The skipper of the boat wishing to raise the bridge will signal the bridge tender either by horn or radio asking the bridge to open. Most often several boats will go through the bridge travailing in both directions, but it is not unusual for a single boat with only two or three occupants to tie-up hundreds of cars while they pass.

I have had a few occasions when sailing just for fun I approached a bridge intending to turn and sail back to my starting point before I reached the bridge only to have the tender thoughtfully raise the bridge for me ... you HAVE to go through then and as soon as a decent amount of time has passed you must return and demand the bridge to open so you can get home again

F S

>> Orthodox Jews are not allowed to operate electronic machinery on the Sabbath <<

Presumably that is an issue of interpretation as orthodox Jewish laws were specified more than 2000 years ago when electronic machinery had yet to be invented ... and before the time of automobiles, automobile lanes and traffic lights. [Aside: I assume there must be some link between the code of Hammurabi & Jewish Law].

Then you have to imagine what they do for lighting, light switches, cooking, electrical alarms, doorbells ...

I know that you're not supposed to light a fire on a sabbath (though you can keep one going if it's already burning) so maybe pushing the button=striking a spark to start a fire

We had a bridge like that near home when I was a kid. (It wasn't an intercoastal waterway bridge, but I live near a few of those as well. It was for the entrance to Clear Lake southeast of Houston. The Johnson Space Center has a disused dock on its shore for the sea transport of rocket parts.)

During heavy traffic times, both water and vehicular, the bridge raised every 15 minutes. I seem to recall that bridge holding some record for being the tallest bascule drawbridge. It only needed to be raised for tall masted sailboats. However, at that time, the Clear Lake and Galveston Bay area had the highest density of pleasure boats in the country. It was replaced by 76 foot tall bridge in the early 80's. Oddly enough, the pilings for the adjacent railroad swing bridge still sits there in the Clear Lake entrance 40 years after they closed that stretch of railroad and 35 years after they removed the bridge itself. The pilings remain a hazard today as at high tides the base is below the water surface.