h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Gruesome #1 has just been diagnosed with this. I have been googling like mad but only come up with Attention Deficit (Hyperactivity) Disorder.

Is it the same thing? (could it be that German doctors just call it something different?)

Anyway, she's not hyperactive. She has had the Brain scan thing (EKG) and it is "normal". Her IQ is slightly above average. She writes well and reads well (nearly as well as a German kid of 8 - which is to say not as well as I would like, but that's a whole other matter.)

She does daydream, and she will make a mountain out of a molehill as far as doing homework is concerned - but when it isn't me or doing the homework with here (she is with her childminder 3 days a week) she does it. Even if it is slow sometimes.

She does get quite tearful sometimes, and cries at the drop of a hat.

I guess that is what in my childhood would have been called sensitive (by adults) and a cry-baby (by other kids).

She is a little on the plump side, but then so am I and so are the other members of the family whom she most resembles.That's something we are going to have to watch - but I'm not making a drama out of that.

Today I went for a chat with the doc who diagnosed. He seems to be one that won't go for a parent like me (who wholeheartedly disagrees with the diagnosis).

The steps he thinks we should take to "cope" with her now "officially" being what is termed a difficult child are things we do (as much as we can) anyway.

Any advice? I will not allow her to take any medication for this condition that I do not believe she has, unless "the condition" seems to threaten her life.

It certainly sounds like the same thing to me, just slightly re-named.

In my experience children with ADHD can't keep still for more than two minutes, are into everything all at once, don't really see boundaries in behaviour and tend to scream a lot when challenged. (They can also be very chatty and eloquant and be very intelligent)

Most of the more negative bits of this doesn't really sound like your little person

But I am NOT a doctor, just a friend.

Jules

Ooh yes and the medication is usually to get them to calm down (and be more manageable). Appropriate here?

Maybe it's the same as Attention Deficit Disorder? A.D.D.?

Which is also known as ADHD.

Sho, have you seen this link?

http://www.teachernet.gov.uk/teachingandlearning/library/adhd/

Don't know if it is helpful but it's there.

Jules

I was under the impression that ADD and ADHD are two distinct disorders

Oh no, hope I haven't said something very stupid I'm 99% sure that folk here say they are the same. I'm off to get my file on SEN, syndromes and similar

Thanks for the link Jules, I'll read that carefully.

There are two disorders, with and without hyperactivity.Now while she's not a slug, #1 deffo is not hyperactive. She's dreamy and dawdles and ... well, not attentive.

To that extent I agree with the doctors and her teacher (who reckoned in any case that if she has it, it is mild) and I also agree about what we should do to encourage her.

I did mention today to the doc that she is bilingual - it seems that even though when went with her, and spoke English to her, the doc hadn't actually noticed... although the teacher knows because I am very vocal about how we will NOT speak German at home. (he thinks we should, which I find totally odd since we're all English, and he comes from a mixed language family himself... but I'm drifting)

I guess really what I want to hear is "oh, you'll be ok... she'll snap out of it" when what I need is some time and patience and for the rest of the world to go away and leave me alone to give her some time.

Btw: my childminder's two older boys are ADHD - they are like rabid chimps when they don't have their meds. It's scary to see how docile they are when they have popped a pill. which is one reason I'm so against it.

Does anyone know anything about symptoms of stress in young children? Because I certainly am overstressed and near to snapping a lot of the time, I think that could be a huge part of her "problem" but we always seem to be rushing about, that could be a part too?

Or am I just so anti the idea of ADS (because I think it's over diagnosed) that I don't want to see the truth of it all?

According to these folk, from whom I have got a lot of info ( and who have stands at major SEN conferences in the UK), they are the same. There are strands within the disorder but ADD = ADHD as far as I can see.

http://www.oaasis.co.uk and look under Info sheets

Jules

Sorry, Sho - that was to Gosho.

And you're right, I see now, there is the extra H when there's the hyperactive bit. This is the bit with the most publicity here, definately.

Will look out any stress stuff I have for you.

Jules

thanks Jules,you're a love. When I mentioned Stress the doc just gave me an odd look.

Like the one he gave me when I mentioned that I work full time and that isn't at home in the evening or weekends.

I think I'm about to have another round of Working Mum Guilt and Depression Syndrome.

These folks http://www.add.org/ say that ADD, ADHD, and AD/HD are interchangeable terms

I think I'll just walk away slowly and pretend I was never here

I'll see if I can find some bits and bobs to send you, but I doubt I can add much if we have a SENCO on the thread.

What's a SENCO? And thanks Mr. P... I have some books coming from Mr. Amazon so I think I have plenty of stuff to be going on with.

Right, Jules, each of those links made my ancient PC give up the ghost. So I'll get them from my zippy fast thing at work.

Gosho - I find that all confusing, since my understanding is that the terms are not interchangeable at all. The doc clearly stated ADS (ADD) without the Hyperactivity. Sort of ADHD without the H.

Doesn't make sense to me either. Hence me pestering h2g2.

Also, because I heard the reports about the MMR/Autism link (or not) on the Today programme today, I'm wondering if, as was suggested with Autism and related things, ADS/ADD/ADHD is being over diagnosed because we just want to put a label on everythig these days.

Is my attitude partly to be put down to the fact that even the barest hint from someone that my kids are "less than perfect" in connection with the fact that I work full time (in an environment where that is very rare) is a criticism of me?

A colleague of mine's son has it and he is very hard work to talk to and be with, now aged 10.

There has been so much about doctor's false diagnoses, and after denying that such a thing exists for so long, they are probably now swinging the other way and slapping the diagnosis on any kid without taking a serious look.

Don't you take any bullsh*t about speaking the wrong language and "confusing" the child with two languages. If anything, you should use a third language to exercise her intelligence a bit more. With this ridiculous system in primary school here in Germany (and the kids being kept down to the lowest common denominator) the problem is probably that she's not got enough to occupy her mind.

Concentration is very important at all times in life, at school and at work. So give her scope to practise sticking at stuff for long periods - missing or postponing meals if she doesn't want to be distracted. There's nothing more annoying than seeing kids in Kindergarten or at home, totally engrossed in what they are doing, being told to "tidy up" or "come and have tea" or "wipe your nose" or "do you want something to drink".

Your child minder is a heroine, two difficult kids and taking on another. What does she think, by the way.

I'm not a SENCO, btw. If you meant me. But I move in such circles!

'Also, because I heard the reports about the MMR/Autism link (or not) on the Today programme today, I'm wondering if, as was suggested with Autism and related things, ADS/ADD/ADHD is being over diagnosed because we just want to put a label on everythig these days.'

I think, Sho, or at least I know here in the UK, if you haven't got a 'label' you don't get any help anymore. The powers that be are getting rid of any 'pre-emptive, generally helpful to the slower kids' stuff, it seems to me and going back to picking up the pieces later (in my county anyhow) - so to qualify for help you now need to have a diagnosis. You can see what I feel about that .

Jules

And I didn't mean anything bad by 'slower kids'. I don't feel that's a bad term but I know some folk take offence at it. We all know there are kids across the academic spectrum in a school and that's all I meant by that. Me, I'm particularly slow at Science and indeed the school forbade me to do GCSE Physics!

TC, I am actually quite staggered at the attitude in our neck of the woods towards us as a bilingual family. There are next to no "foreign" children in the Gruesomes' school - there are only 120 kids, and I can think, off the top of my head, of only one other child who has two parents who aren't German. (she's chinese and in the same class as #2, this year I am determined to chat to her parents about this sort of thing)

I am more staggered given that #1's teacher is the school's English teacher. He shold KNOW that she is bound to be slower in reading & writing.

She has a massive vocabulary, apparently, of which I am strangely proud.

The doc, however, nearly got a slap from me (baaad example to set) when I mentioned her languages, and he said words to the effect of "well, the teacher can't make a special case just for her"

oh really? I thought that was why the teacher was the one who mentioned it...

and now I'm having one of those massive silent "arguments" with because he somehow believes that doctors are god-like creatures who are never wrong - and that I "read too much"....

onwards with research.

Oh, and I don'T mind anyone talking about slower kids. I benefitted from streamed schooling in junior school (probably because I was in the A stream... who knows, but I do know that I would have been totally put off if I'd been in a class full of people cleverer than me) I think we all have to recognise that some of us are better at some things than others

That's what makes humans so interesting.

Well, I have now pushed up the Amazon share price, and emptied my bank balance, and we'll see how I get on.

Now I need to tackle the Working Mother Gult Syndrome and we'll be finished.

Oh and TC, thanks for your tips - I'll see how we get on at the weekend.

One of her problems is that she is very easily discouraged, and I'm not very patient. Plus #2 is a quite... demanding child, and it's turning out that she is very bright.

We have been working on Maths and writing at the weekends - and #2 is sreaking ahead of #1, who is further discouraged and whiny, which leads to me getting a bit impatient. Then I leave her for 5 minutes to attend to #2 and give #1 (and me) a chance to calm down... then she just sits staring into space.

I really think I need to get a part time job on the Aldi check out, and pay more attention to the kids.

But then, I'm the main breadwinner, so it's not doable.