h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

They might not have been able to move the Earth through that dimensional pathway, along with the tardis. Though how it survived going several times the speed of light I don´t know.

yeah, can't move a large massive object through multi-dimensional space, but can break all known laws of physics.

As for previous examples in the current incarnation - proof positive that RTD doesn't understand the TARDIS. And more examples besides - such as the number of times it has been towed away or captured merely by confining the physical protrusion into our reality.

Except when it doesn't fit the story line such as in "Father's Day"

Well even if you capture just the three-dimensional protusion, the rest of it must likely have to follow. Like grabbing the tail of an animal and pulling.

And what happened to the moon in all this? Surely if the earth was 'removed' the moon would shoot out of her previous orbit (around Earth) and gravitate towards the nearest larger object?

Now you´re just overthinking it.

"Well even if you capture just the three-dimensional protusion, the rest of it must likely have to follow. Like grabbing the tail of an animal and pulling."

Well, no, not really. I could move my finger such that it intersected a particular 2D plane. Inhabitants of that 2D plane could then surround the intersection of my finger in their 2Dplane such that I could not move it in those 2 dimensions. But I have a 2rd dimension to play with and could remove my finger using only the Z axis and not moving it at all within the 2D plane thus escaping their trap.

Equally in a 3D world I could be surrounded on all sides, but if I can move in the 4th dimension I can escape the trap by moving in time but not in space. Thus if I had access to all dimensions I could escape any trap.

re: the moon. No, the moon would just go into orbit about the sun. Which it is anyway, sort of. Hence why the moon was still there. Although what would have happened to Cruithne (which does actually orbit the sun, not the earth, we just mess its orbit up for it) is anyones guess

Ahh, but what if they placed hooks into your finger instead of just placing walls around it?

Then the moving finger wouldn't write on the wall?!!

their hooks would be 2D hooks and as such I would be able to slip off them using the 3rd dimension.

"re: the moon. No, the moon would just go into orbit about the sun. Which it is anyway, sort of."

I get that but...

The moon is orbiting Earth and Earth's gravitational pull keeps her in 'the loop'. If Earth disappeared, the moon wouldn't be kept in her loop and, instead of 'turning left' in her normal orbit, would continue in a 'straight' line. This would still be in orbit around the sun but, when she encountered a planet with a strong enough gravitational pull, wouldn't she crash into it or orbit around it? I expect it would take some time, and the Who thing seemed to last a matter of days, but wouldn't that happen?

I know little about these things and I have in my head how the 70s NASA spacecraft used the gravitational pull of planets to 'slingshot' to the next planet so I expect I have a confused picture of how these things work.

Ictoan, do you work for the Shadow Proclamation?!

Yes the Moon would be shot off into space if the Earth disappeared. It would probably enter an orbit around the sun eventually.

I´m not sure those 2D hooks wouldn´t be enough to keep you trapped. Think of them placed as little question marks placed sideways into your finger. It would keep you from moving to the sides, but also from moving up and down, as your finger would not be able to pass through the hooks.

But that makes them 3D hooks doesn't it? Isn't that the point? The hooks are working on one level but what they're trying to hook can work on a different level.

This conversation is getting strange but in a fun way My understanding of it is that (and this example may well be rubbish!) a caterpillar that was trapped in the middle of a spider's web couldn't move left/right/up/down (ie 2D) but could move backwards/forwards (3D) to escape. I'm not sure how the 4D thing works (I'm assuming 4D is space ) but the fifth dimension (time) means that, if the caterpillar can be in the same place before/after the spider's web was there, he wouldn't be trapped by it so can escape.

Shall I get my coat?

the moon would not have shot off into space without the earth. There's a fairly large object central to it's complicated orbit that would have stopped that. It would have performed some very complicated, and no doubt impressive, orbital gymnastics, but sol would have been able to keep it roughly in place.
Plus all the other planets and objects which also have an impact on its orbit would have kept it roughly within the same orbit. Venus et al pushing it away and Mars et al pushing it back in.

As for the hooks, you are still thinking in 3d. A 2d hook can only have X and Y dimensions. I can move in Z space. Thus I could move up, or down, the Z axis without changing my X,Y coordinates thus not encountering any resistance from said hooks.

van-smeiter - the fourth dimension is time. The first three are the X, Y and Z axis that place an object within our space. We can move at will (usually!) within 3D space and exist within 4D space but cannot (yet ) move at will within the time dimension.

Yes the moon would not shoot off into interstellar space, but it would still leave the Earth. Though I don´t see how Venus would push it.

Well, imagine drawing a square on a piece of paper. That would be like a 2D prison cell. A 3D creature would have no problem going in and out by moving up or down and so bypassing the cell wall. However it could presumably still not penetrate the cell wall. Same with the hooks, you can´t move to the sides and up and down doesn´t work as you can´t move through the hooks.

I'm still not sure about these hooks

What I said about the caterpillar was what Ictoan just said (more succinctly than me) but I see what Xanatic means because, although my caterpillar can move up and down, he can't leave that axis and so can't really escape the spider's web (though he can chrysalise, enter the fourth dimension and escape as a butterfly! )

I think I get the moon business now. Earth disappears, the moon no longer goes round in a circle but carries on in the orbit of the sun that she was pretty much doing when Earth was there; and she doesn't travel close enough to the other planets to get sucked in. Sound about right?

Van

Sorry, got my caterpillar's up/down mixed up with his forward/backward but still mean what Ictoan said.

The reason I got confused about fourth and fifth dimensions was because of what Susan says in An Unearthly Child about the fifth dimension being "Space".

Though far be it for me to introduce concepts from a BBC science fiction programme into this conversation!!

It's a magic box, innit?

I love these silly conversations

...aren't we taking this a tad too seriously now?


"It's a magic box, innit?"

I'd go with that.

Personally I thought the towing of the Earth was rather fun, who cares whether it's scientifically accurate? At the end of the day it's a kid's tv show. Maybe i'm just abig kid at heart, but my first thought was:

"whoah- "