Correspondence between h2g2 Editorial and Satyagraha
Created | Updated Jan 28, 2002
The following emails are published with the permission of the author(s).
h2g2 Editorial to Satyagraha, 15 January
From: h2g2 EditorialTo: Satyagraha
Sent: Tue 1/15/02 11:24 AM
Subject: Official Notification from the h2g2 Editors: Account Suspended
Dear 'Satyagraha',
We recently received a number of complaints from fellow h2g2 Researchers
that say your account was being operated by LeKZ. In investigating these
claims we've looked at your account, and it does appear that it was opened
and is being operated by the same human being as the one who opened the
'Arpeggio', 'Mourning Becomes Electra', 'Silent Lucidity' and 'Quincy'
accounts.
As LeKZ is permanently banned from h2g2, obviously we have no choice but
to close down the 'Satyagraha' account too.
As a result we have now suspended your h2g2 account for one week, pending
a permanent ban, while we implement the transgressions procedure described
here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/guide/A642296
If you believe you have any mitigating reasons why you should not be
banned permanently, please reply to this email explaining them. We will
read your replies and consider their contents before coming to a decision
regarding a lifetime ban. Our decision will be made in one week, and will
be final; no correspondence will be entered into. Please remember when
replying that any abusive, threatening, or offensive emails will result in
the immediate and permanent ban on your account, as will any attempt to
return to the site under a different account.
Alternatively, you may agree to accept that you are indeed posting on h2g2
as a banned Researcher and accept the closure of your account, in which
case the transgression proceedure will not be implemented, if that is what
you would prefer.
If you have any Guide Entries you wish to copy off our servers, your space
will remain readable and unaltered for the duration of your suspension.
Your Guide Entries may not be easily retrievable after that date.
Yours sincerely,
The h2g2 Editors
Satyagraha to h2g2 Editorial, 15 January
From: SatyagrahaTo: h2g2 Editorial
Sent: Tue 1/15/02 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: Official Notification from the h2g2 Editors: Account Suspended
Of course you closed it. I am not surprised. I spoke to defend Quincy, who
you also are believing is LeKZ, so this must logically make me also LeKZ, is
it not?
I do not to defend myself against accusation made without proof. You do not
know I am any one in particular, and you do not know I am not, but I will
allow you to make martyr of me as necessary if it is so, to demonstrate you
go about this accusation you make on no evidence and less substantiation.
That was my point about Quincy. Maybe someone will say so about me.
Of course, you would never ask the criminal LeKZ herself because you believe
she is liar. Please find out what mean 'satyagraha'. I don't lie. It is
not my nature, religion, nor is their any reason for me to lie. And is not
reason for me to defend myself against you.
Evidently 'j'accuse' is enough. French Revolution does meet the Internet.
I find this very funny, but very tragic.
On any one's say so? Or is it usually the same ones, who maybe have the
issues with LeKZ, you are condemning people of being LeKZ without we are
given any chance to say for ourselves. I am sorry. I am most sorry that
your honesty and your values are so deranged by the fear of the monstre
LeKZ. You must not sleep safe at night, hein?
What oath would it take? I make none, but I am curious what would you
believe?
Satyagraha.
I have another name, but that is not for you.
Satyagraha to h2g2 Editorial, 16 January
We received this email after we announced on site that a trace of Satyagraha's account led to an ISP in the Denver, Colorado area.
Please note that this email was originally sent to us in a slightly different form. This original email asked for it to be kept confidential, so we asked Satyagraha to send a version that we could publish (we received the edited version as part of this email, but have reproduced it here to retain the flow).
From: SatyagrahaTo: h2g2 Editorial, LeKZ
CC: Willem van der Merwe, Barton Rolsky, David Conway
Sent: Wed 1/16/02 5:02 AM
Subject: Sam Thierry, Coming Clean
For whatever it may be worth, which is probably nil, I request of everyone
who reads this email to treat it with respect, especially the parts about
Murray Strauss, M.D. 'Quincy'. I don't want to risk any embarrassment to
him whatsoever.
This is why I lied, much though I hate doing that, and not about too many
things: because I needed to try to make Murray believe he doesn't know me.
He knows all about it now. Still, it's a bit sensitive and I may have hurt
his feelings and that was the opposite of my intention.
I am did this, came clean to the Editors, to LeKZ, to Mr. Barton Rolsky, and
Mr. David Conway (Not Banned Yet), because I was asked to do so rather
firmly, by Mlle the Major Manon de Valognes, she says, of the Internal
military of LeKZ, who she claims are a multiple personality. This is very
far outside of my experience, though I don't have any business judging it in
any way. Still, this banning of people for allegedly being her or them
hurts her or them more than it does me, so I decided to forward my reply to
the Editors. Note that LeKZ didn't say anything about speaking to the
Editors but her letter, attached in the original French below (with my
translation below it) with permission, made it pretty clear that my behavior
and Murray's could reflect on her. Especially mine, as no one was defending
me at that time.
All right. It is true that I live just at the south end of a small, sleepy
town called Lafayette, Colorado. I lied because I did not want that
connection made by Murray or anyone. I should not have claimed to live
anywhere in particular, but I was a bit panicked by how things were going.
I sent an email to Mr. Rolsky in which I foolishly claimed to live in
Phoenix, AZ. According to LeKZ (I don't know how the formalities should be,
for a multiple personality, so I will use the name as everyone does) it
seems that there was conclusive proof from the email that I live in
Colorado, and probably not far from LeKZ. Okay. So it's true. I'm about
halfway or a little less, toward Boulder, between Denver and Boulder.
It is also true that I am 52, from France originally, did all the things I
said I had done in my life, did nothing wrong at h2g2 except defend Quincy
and speak against what I thought was manipulative and prejudicial language
against him. Since that is not the charge against me, but rather the
charge is that I am LeKZ, I say again that I am not, unless she is also a 52
year old gay man, from France. I am innocent of any wrongdoing, and innocent
of the banishable offense of being LeKZ, and expect my account to be
re-instated in good standing, as I did nothing.
I know Dr. Strauss personally, because he volunteers at an AIDS hospice in
Boulder and I do too after my partner, who was the one who wanted to move to
the United States from Québéc, died there six years ago. I don't know
Murray well. He knows me less so. I do have an accent, but it's not as
bad as I pretended -- clever people to see through that -- I was back
pretending because I didn't want Murray to realise who I am -- and he's
sharp. You see, I keep kind of an eye on him. He's a really good man, and
he's a very caring person. I had them change my hours to overlap with his.
Volunteering there, he feels like he is helping, and that is something he
needs very badly to be doing. He's seen too much. I'd know. Gay men have
that look in our eyes, too.
I know his history because he's talkative. You know, Jewish New Yorker?
Typical. It's so cute. I am what I said I am in all ways, except I had to
make with the franglais a bit too much, and emphasise all my time not in the
USA, and pretend not to live around here, because I didn't want him to know.
He's not homophobic. We're not lovers. What's relevant is I've been
looking out for him because he's not really holding together as well as he
thinks. I know about grief, okay? You would as a gay man my age, and I
stayed on at that hospice full time for a while, then went back to work, and
now I'm retired and volunteer part time. He is one hurting guy. There is
so much good in his heart but he's just seen too much.
He's proud, though. New York City law enforcement and civil servants were
the heroes of September, and it means everything to him to be part of that
world. He wants to go back and he is not ready. He knows he's not ready,
but he's really homesick. He's got a sister in California he's going to
stay with in a while, and shuttle around the country. While he's here, he's
seeing really good help, from what he says. But sometimes, I just see him
go off in a corner and cry, or come out of the men's room and he looks real
bad like he's been vomiting. I worry. I kept telling him go do something
fun, like on the internet.
Then he came in all excited about this place he found online that's based on
Douglas Adams' books and I listened while he talked. So I thought I'd check
it out too. I also hoped it would be fun. I am pretty solitary, and I like
my life that way. Still, it was something different. I didn't have
anything but really fun conversations, at h2g2. Murray wasn't quite as
lucky. But he was online more than I was, too. I can't sit in front of a
computer for hours and hours. It's not natural for me.
For me, h2g2 was a nice place, but I had to do a bit of fiddling with the
facts, and I try to remember how I wrote English when we first moved here;
which was very, very badly. Then this thing happened where Murray's accused
of being LeKZ. We communicate pretty much every day by email, just "hi, how
are you?" because we're only at the hospice four times a week. So I had to
make a bogus accent. Are you starting to see? He emailed me at my regular
address, to say "this is so weird", so I had to say something, because I
know the guy, no?
What could I say? "I know he's not LeKZ because I'm the guy who's watching
how he's holding up at the hospice", huh? He's a proud man. I didn't want
to offend him. I don't know who LeKZ is because, well, I've been there a
week, and who knows all of everything, eh?
So I spoke against what I saw as openly prejudicial remarks by the Editors
of h2g2, and I said what I thought. I DID see a
Khmer-Rouge "trial". (It was worse than you probably think). I know when
hearsay and rumor are being presented as facts. I have a Doctorate of
Letters in Philosophy, from a university in Sénégal. I have read a lot,
speak many languages, read many more, and I am not perfect. I lost the love
of my life. Murray Strauss is a little like me, the first few years after
Réné died. He's haunted. I felt bad for him.
I do try to live by the principle of satyagraha, so if judging the words of
the Editors to be intentionally prejudicial was the truth, I was compelled
to say it to serve the greater good of ending the harm to Murray, to LeKZ,
and as I said, to the website and to society. That's how I believe, and
satyagraha means resisting without violence (or with if it is unavoidable)
all injustice and untruth. What could I do but act? Anyone with any grasp
of satyagraha would understand, and if I lied, and I did, it was to prevent
unnecessary harm from coming to someone else, not to protect myself. When
LeKZ called me on my actions, I saw the truth in what she said, and followed
up at once.
I don't care about myself, so much, but the Editors can't kick me off h2g2
for being someone I am not, just because I live in the same area code
dialing area as someone some of you and the Editors have a grudge against.
Speaking of flaming and grudges, some of the things people have been saying
about LeKZ are pretty shocking to me. They sound as though they are
hallucinating or something, if everyone from Colorado, with a conscience,
and an interest in justice, is LeKZ.
The Editors said they did not prove anything conclusive, with your trace on
me, but very few people seem to have taken that part of what they said into
consideration. They had no proof at all against Murray. They have asked
him for proof, and as of this writing, I was right. I said last night "if
I know Murray, he'll stand by his right to be innocent till proven guilty."
He can (and has) quoted the Declaration of Independence at length, to help
motivate people. Somehow when he does it, it isn't corny.
I consider LeKZ's email which follows (presumably the Editors will provide a
translation of her fairly good French) proof that I am not LeKZ. Once you
have seen it, or the translation, I believe you will too, unless this is all
a farce, in which case, I am just as happy without h2g2 now as I was a week
ago, and no doubt Murray will find something that is more fun, too.
Sincerely,
Samuél THIERRY
'Satyagraha'
----- Original Message -----
From: LeKZ
To: Satyagraha
Sent: Tuesday, 15 January, 2002 19:58
Subject: M. THIERRY, Rêpondez vitement, svp
M. THIERRY,
Nous sommes en recept de votres comminqués avec notre bon ami, M. Barton
Rolsky. Je suis Mlle la Majeur Manon de Valognes, qui serve la militaire
Intérnale de LeKZ. Mes apologies pour les manques et fautes de mon écriture
français. Comme vous-même, nous (nous comprisons une/s personalité/e/s
multiples, j'espére que ce n'est pas trop bizarre pour vous) avons appris
parler et lire français très jeunes, mais l'écriture on n'a jamais appris
jusqu'a l'école, aux E.U. Donc, la vocabulaire est beaucoup meillieure que
l'orthographie, qui en son tour est meilleure que la grammaire et
utilisation des marques diacritiques, duquel franchement on s'en fou de
faire l'effort.
Vous avez dit des choses autours de vous-même, sur lesquelles il y a de
l'évidence au contraire, laquelle nous trouvons croyable. En bref, ce que
vous avez dit n'est pas exactement la véritude. Je sais qu'il y a plein du
monde qui se représentent différentment sur l'internet qu'en realité. Ce
n'est pas une probléme, pour moi, en générale. Si le monde veulent être des
menteurs, ça n'a rien à faire avec moi. Mais vous vous trouvez dans la
position d'être accusé de la crime
<< être LeKZ >>. Autant que nous sommes, en faite, LeKZ, votre maniére de
vous conduire se reflechisse, pour bien ou pour mal -- en ce cas,
certainement pour mal -- sur nous aussi.
Alors, je vous en prie, réspondez avec tout honneté, et je dois vous dire
que j'ai le nez pour les mensonges, parce que je voudrais mettre la
confience en vous. Vous avez parlez bien et clairement pour M. le Docteur
Strauss, aussi connu comme << Quincy >>, et vous avez donné à [name of h2g2 researcher]
exactement ce qu'il a gagné pour se faire rigolo. Hélas, en ce faire,
vous avez payer le prix: vous êtes devenu LeKZ.
Oú habitez-vous, vraiement, et d'oú avez-vous fait votre lien avec
l'internet? h2g2 disent << Denver >>. J'habite pas loin de Denver,
Colorado, et les derniéres informations que les Abuseurs de Pouvoir chez
h2g2 ont, sur moi, me misent proche à Denver. Ce n'est pas conclusif, parce
qu'il y a une grande population dans le mégalopolis qui est Denver et
vicine. On peut même incluire Boulder dans ce mégalopolis. Barton m'a
donné de l'évidence qui suggére que vous n'êtes pas loin du tout d'ici.
Pourquoi la mensonge autours de Tuscon, Arizona, qui est tout-a-fait
impossible, avec ces faites ici?
Expliquez-vous, svp. Plus compléte, et plus honnête, plus on peut vous
donnez la supporte. Si il n-y a pas de rêponse, on va considérer la
possibilité que vous êtes un de ces, qui s'amusent avec la peine des autres.
J'espére que je ne dois pas vous répudier, mais j'ais juré sur les âmes
sacrés, que je ne sais rien de vous. C'est la vérité, et je ne vais pas
donner l'impression d'être menteuse, ni à mes amis, ni à mes ennemies. Vous
comprenez, je suis sur.
Maj. Manon de Valognes,
pour la personne entiére, qui est LeKZ
********************************************
Translation by Sam Thierry:
Mr. Thierry,
We are in receipt of your communcations with our good friend Mr. Barton
Rolsky. I am Mademoiselle the Major Manon de Valognes, who serves in the
Internal military of LeKZ. My apologies for the lacks and faults of my
French writing. Like yourself, we (we comprise a multiple person/s, I hope
that's not too bizarre for you) learned to speak and read French very young,
but the writing, we never learned it until school in the USA. So, the
vocabulary is better than the spelling, which is in turn better than the
grammar, and frankly f--k the diacritical marks. [She didn't do so bad,
really - ST]
You have said things about yourself on which there is evidence to the
contrary, which evidence we find believable. In brief, what you said is not
exactly the truth. I know there are plenty of people who represent
themselves differently on the Internet and in reality. This is not a
problem for me, in general. If people want to be liars, this has nothing to
do with me. But you find yourself in the position of being accused of the
crime "being LeKZ". Being that we are, in fact, LeKZ, the manner in which
you conduct yourself, reflects, for good or bad -- in this case for bad --
on us as well as you.
So, please, I ask you to respond in all honesty, and I must tell you I have
the nose for lies, because I would like to put trust in you. You spoke well
and clearly for Mr. the Doctor Strauss, also known as "Quincy", and you gave
to [name of h2g2 researcher] exactly what he wins for making himself ridiculous [not a
perfect translation of "rigolo", because that's slang, maybe a combination
of "shameful" and "foolish"- ST]. Alas, in so doing, you have paid the
price: you have become LeKZ.
Where do you live, really? And from where do you link to the internet?
h2g2 say "Denver". I live not far from Denver, Colorado, and the last
informations the Abusers of Power at h2g2 have, on me, put me close to
Denver. This is inconclusive, because there is a big population in the
megalopolis that is Denver and vicinity [usually called the "Denver Metro
Area" - ST]. One can even include Boulder in this megalopolis. Barton has
given me evidence that suggests that you are not far at all from here. Why
the lie about Tuscon, Arizona, which is completely impossible with these
facts, here?
Explain yourself, please. The more completely, and the more honestly, the
more one can give you support. If there is no response, one will consider
the possibility that you are one of those [people] who amuse themselves with
the pain of others.
I hope I don't have to repudiate you, but I have sworn on sacred souls, that
I know nothing of you. This is the truth, and I am not going to give the
impression of being a liar, neither to my friends, nor to my enemies. You
understand, I am sure.
Maj. Manon de Valognes
for the entire person who is LeKZ
h2g2 Editorial to Satyagraha, 16 January
From: h2g2 EditorialTo: Satyagraha
Sent: Wed 1/16/02 1:05 PM
Subject: RE: Sam Thierry, Coming Clean
Hi Mr Thierry.
Many thanks for your response.
In cases like this we tend to put the question to the larger Community,
and we think it would be useful for those discussing the issue on site to
see your explanation below of why you use the same ISP as LeKZ. It would
also be useful to publish the email you sent us entitled "Re: Official
Notification from the h2g2 Editors: Account Suspended". Would this be
acceptable to you? If you would rather rewrite the email below so it does
not mention Murray Strauss, then that would be fine too. Putting your side
of the story into the public discussion would, we think, be very constructive.
It is, of course, up to you - do please let us know.
The h2g2 Editors
Satyagraha to h2g2 Editorial, 16 January
From: SatyagrahaTo: h2g2 Editorial
Sent: Wed 1/16/02 1:05 PM
Subject: RE: Sam Thierry, Coming Clean
I will write to Murray, and explain the situation, and then you may post my
"Coming Clean" email. I don't want the franglais one, in which I claimed
not to lie, and stuff, made public. It was written in a panic and I don't
like how dumb it makes me look.
If it turns out to be a problem for Murray, I'll let you know. You won't
see this until tomorrow your time anyway.
Sam THIERRY
Satyagraha to h2g2 Editorial, 17 January
From: SatyagrahaTo: h2g2 Editorial
CC: Willem van der Merwe, Barton Rolsky, David Conway, LeKZ
Sent: Thu 1/17/02 3:31 AM
Subject: FW: Sam Thierry, Coming Clean
To the Editors at h2g2, please use the following text, modified slightly
from the email I sent you, for public posting. Note that you do not have my
permission to post this unless you also post both this introduction in its
entirety, and the attached email (in French, with a translation I have
added) from LeKZ to myself, because the tone of that email is a substantial
part of my case that I am not she and visa-versa. I have emailed Murray
Strauss, and he is considering what to do next, for himself, but he does not
mind my speaking for him, along with myself, since we are obviously
associates. As of this writing, he is still "Taking the Fifth", or
exercising his right according to the US Constitution to remain silent in
the face of what he believes to be an unfair proceedings, which he won't
play along. I am not at all surprised. I said as much, yesterday.
Samuél Thierry
[Version supplied is published above]
Satyagraha to h2g2 Editorial, 18 January
From: SatyagrahaTo: h2g2 Editorial
CC: Willem van der Merwe, Barton Rolsky, David Conway, LeKZ
Sent: Fri 1/18/02 1:31 AM
Subject: RE: Sam Thierry, Coming Clean
Dear h2g2 Editorial,
I was under the impression you were to have posted the email that I sent
you, regarding myself, Dr Strauss, how we know one another, and so on, at
h2g2 today, 16 January 2002. Please can you explain the delay? You may
also post this publicly.
I also observed that now there are allegations that Dr Strauss and I
conspired with LeKZ to post in her behalf. This is an interesting, even
fanciful theory, it is however, wholly untrue. Neither of us was aware of
LeKZ or anyone else from h2g2 in this area and other than herself and her
companion, Mr Conway, are not aware of any others, until you made the
connection for us. Of course, once you had done so, it was not very
difficult to find her website. Indeed, in one of his postings, [name of h2g2 researcher]
indicated I should go to someone's userspace and click on the link there,
and I did so.
What I would love to hear is a credible theory as to why we would engage in
such behavior. We didn't. We could not have. Dr Strauss is ill and too
sensible for such nonsense, and I don't really have any interest in engaging
in childish efforts to fool the Editors of a website about which I know
almost nothing. I spend most of my time in teaching students of one
discipline or another, and the rest reading peacefully. I don't interact
much with anyone, because I'm a solitary sort of person. You have now had
allegations that Dr Strauss and I are in some way connected with LeKZ, and
would post on her behalf? What, if you please, could I have said, that
would be something she felt such a burning need to say, that she could not
have set up her own account if she had to say it. There have been no
suicide attempts at h2g2 in the past several days. The people who have
alleged that my account was established merely to defend Quincy have not
checked the dates. You know we signed on close to the same time.
All that matters to me here is that you are publicly accusing innocent
people of things we did not do. This is not good for you, for us, for
anyone. This adds to the generally suspicious and malicious nature of the
world. You seem not to be capable of believing that LeKZ is not interested
in your website or activities, and that I joined on a whim, and Dr Strauss
after a websearch, and none ot these things has anything to do with the
other. I do not own a television. I choose to use the radio and the
internet. I prefer not to use the telephone. These are personal quirks
having to do with my need for quiet, and peace. I am what most people would
call asocial. I don't like large groups of bodies crowded together making
noise. I don't even interact much socially offline. Less and less.
Isolative is the other word. I like my solitude. A bereaved gay man who is
marking time.
Is this the sort of person who would involve himself in such silliness? It
is not. I am profoundly insulted for LeKZ, because it is really she who is
being accused of this obsession. Don't flatter yourselves so much. She has
had other things to do in her life besides care what goes on at h2g2. If it
is not you flattering yourselves, then it is the people who invented these
complaints.
I deny them. I further think it quite embarrassing for you to have given
them any credence at all.
In the final analysis, I don't mind one way or the other what happens to me,
but LeKZ's name must be cleared. I think you are desperate, if you are
resorting to such foolish notions.
Sincerely,
Samuél THIERRY
h2g2 Editorial to Satyagraha, 18 January
From: h2g2 EditorialTo: Satyagraha
Sent: Fri 1/18/02 12:24 PM
Subject: RE: Posting my email?
Hi Satyagraha.
> I was under the impression you were to have posted the email that I sent
> you, regarding myself, Dr Strauss, how we know one another, and so on, at
> h2g2 today, 16 January 2002. Please can you explain the delay? You may
> also post this publicly.
We're sorry you thought we were going to post your email on a specific
date; we didn't say anything in our email to imply that we were
considering that. Here's what we said:
"In cases like this we tend to put the question to the larger Community,
and we think it would be useful for those discussing the issue on site to
see your explanation below of why you use the same ISP as LeKZ. It would
also be useful to publish the email you sent us entitled "Re: Official
Notification from the h2g2 Editors: Account Suspended". Would this be
acceptable to you? If you would rather rewrite the email below so it does
not mention Murray Strauss, then that would be fine too. Putting your side
of the story into the public discussion would, we think, be very
constructive."
There's no date in there, there's no promise to publish your emails, and
there's also an indication that we'd like to publish the whole story shown
by your emails, not parts of it. We'd therefore like to publish *both*
your first email to us and the second one, not just the second one on its
own. The reason is that your first email said the following:
> I don't lie. It is
> not my nature, religion, nor is their any reason for me to lie.
And your second one said this:
> I lied because I did not want that
> connection made by Murray or anyone.
We feel that this is relevant, and publishing both your emails in their
entirety is the only way to show the whole picture, from which others can
make their deductions. Obviously it's up to you, but we'd like to publish
all your emails, or none; can you let us know which you'd prefer?
Thanks.
h2g2 Editors
Satyagraha to h2g2 Editorial, 18 January
From: SatyagrahaTo: h2g2 Editorial
Sent: Fri 1/18/02 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: Posting my email?
Go ahead and post them all then, please. So long as the second one is
posted in its entirety is not at all a problem any way for me. Yes I did
contradict myself. Please also post this one. I did it because I did not
know what to do. I came clean because I believe LeKZ is the real victim in
all of this and it makes no difference to me if my peccadilo being exposed,
if it is of any help at all to clear her name. She has said nothing, done
nothing. So yes, I did, and even lied about not lying. Please post all of
them.
Sincerely,
Samuél THIERRY
This last email arrived after the office had closed on Friday evening (London time), so we haven't been able to publish these emails until now.
