A Conversation for The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Peer Review: A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 1

Bluebottle

Entry: The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015 - A87917728
Author: Bluebottle - U43530

I've not submitted anything to Peer Review this year, so it is probably about time I did.

I know Dmitri would never forgive me if I didn't dedicate this Disney entry to him - I know exactly how much he loves these films.

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 2

SashaQ - happysad

smiley - laughsmiley - ok

These films are ones that passed me by, but the merchandising was something I was very aware of - the dolls were not quite as good quality as Flower Fairies, say, but I did treat myself to a little dainty version of Silvermist in 2014 when I needed a bit of plastic cuteness smiley - fairy

I enjoyed reading this as I learned a lot smiley - biggrin I had just a couple of questions as I read through:

smiley - orib What is Walt Disney Television Animation?

smiley - orib I wondered what a Stephen Hawking fairy would look like and saw that Scribble is not described as a fairy, but as a 'sparrowman' - are there many differences between the two concepts?

'The End' section is very informative - a surprise ending to the studio indeed...


A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 3

Bluebottle

Walt Disney Television Animation is the Disney division that makes animated television series. It has had a variety of names but was created in 1985 when it made 'Gummi Bears' and 'The Wuzzles' and has since created such childhood classics as 'Goof Troop', 'Duck Tales', 'Chip 'n Dale - Rescue Rangers', 'TaleSpin' etc.

There's a dichotomy between the 'Tinker Bell' films themselves and the spin-off material and DVD extras. In the films both male and female smiley - fairy are called 'Fairies', including the male character 'Fairy Gary' who has 'Fairy' as his name. (Which yes, is as daft as naming a son 'Human Truman', but this is Disney). However in the spin-off stuff only female fairies are called 'fairies' and male fairies instead are called 'Sparrowmen'. Which is a daft name – fortunately not quite so bad as calling the female fairies 'smiley - titgirls'… But who wants to tell poor Fairy Gary (and presumably also Fairy Barry, Fairy Harry and Fairy Larry) that he has to change his name to 'Sparrowman Saruman' because he's no longer allowed to be a fairy because of his birth gender?smiley - blue

Still, I've added a footnote about it in the first 'Tinker Bell' film on this entry.

Anyway, talking of Tinker Bell and JM Barrie's Peter Pan, Jim Steinman wrote the songs on Meat Loaf's 'Bat Out of Hell' album to be the soundtrack to a 'Peter Pan'-inspired musical set in a dystopian future. Can you guess which Peter Pan-inspired character Meat Loaf was to play?

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 4

SashaQ - happysad

Ah, yes - classic TV smiley - ok So Walt Disney Television Animation was classed as the third animation studio that was part of the Walt Disney Company organisation?

"However in the spin-off stuff only female fairies are called 'fairies' and male fairies instead are called 'Sparrowmen'"

Ah smiley - grr I wondered if that was what it would be... That is at least something that the films attempted to reclaim the smiley - fairy term for everyone smiley - magic

A daft name indeed - if they want to get all binary about it, 'smiley - tit girls' or 'smiley - tit women' would be the logical opposites, and I would hope they would agree that that wouldn't go down well...

Neat footnote smiley - ok

"Can you guess which Peter Pan-inspired character Meat Loaf was to play?"

Hmm... My first thought was Hook, but then I thought maybe a Lost Boy, or possibly even Peter Pan himself...


A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 5

Bluebottle

In this case 'Studio' means 'film studio', so chronologically speaking the 'Studios' (which like name changes now and then) are: 1) Walt Disney Animation Studios (the one that makes the Disney classics), 2.) DisneyToon Studios, 3.) Pixar and soon 4.) Blue Sky

Walt Disney Television Animation isn't counted as a film studio – there's a degree of snobbiness between film and television animation. This seems particularly unfair as Walt Disney Television Animation have made films cinematic released independently of DisneyToon Studios; 'Doug's First Movie', 'Recess: School's Out' and 'Teacher's Pet'. Although none of which had any noticeable impact.

Strange but true: in Jim Steinman's original vision of his 'Peter Pan'-inspired play, Meat Loaf would have played a character named 'Tink', loosely based on Tinker Bell. Obvious when you think about it…

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 6

SashaQ - happysad

"In this case 'Studio' means 'film studio'"

Aha smiley - ok Yes, it did seem a bit unfair, but just about makes sense as the 'Television Animation' section's 'film studio' activity was not a major part of its business...

"Obvious when you think about it…"

smiley - laugh Yes indeed! smiley - ok

I am intrigued by Footnote 3 but can't quite grasp what it means... I'm familiar with PAL and NTSC having different numbers of lines, but I didn't know that about the frames per second. So Disney created a movie with 25 frames per second, so a ten second unit would have 250 frames, but at 30 frames per second the frames would be bunched up and only last 8.3 seconds? 4% is the difference between 24 frames per second and 25 frames per second? PAL has fewer frames per second than NTSC, or more?


A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 7

Bluebottle

I've tweaked it a little but I don't want to get more complicated.
Film is a chemical process, videotape is electromagnetic. To draw a typical animated film animators traditionally created 12 frames per second but doubled each frame to get to the 24 frames per second standard for film. Yet when film is converted from film to the home media format is when the difference applies – and DisneyToon Studios was a primarily home media orientated.

If it detracts and distracts from the main focus I can delete the smiley - footprintssmiley - musicalnote.

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 8

SashaQ - happysad

I don't think it is a distraction - it is a fascinating piece of information that deserves to be better known! smiley - eureka

I see as an example Tinkerbell and the Legend of the Neverbeast is 73 minutes long in PAL and 76 minutes long in NTSC, so the PAL is 4% shorter than the NTSC smiley - ok How does the soundtrack work? Is it speeded up by 4% so it is a slightly higher pitch?

I still don't understand the frames per second thing, though...

So the film is 24 frames per second smiley - ok
PAL at 25 frames per second bunches up the frames so it is 4% shorter than the original film, I can see this smiley - ok
NTSC at 30 frames per second would bunch up the frames even more so it would be 20% shorter than the original film?


A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 9

Bluebottle

When film (or PAL) is converted to NTSC every fourth (or fifth) frame is duplicated to get to 30 frames per second. Frames aren't duplicated when converted to PAL. A film's soundtrack is indeed 4% faster in PAL than NTSC. It depends on when the conversion was done – older films (particularly on VHS) would sound slightly higher, but on more recent releases the pitch is automatically adjusted to compensate (though it remains 4% faster).

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 10

Bluebottle

(They don't change frames for PAL as no-one can tell the difference between 24fps & 25fps).
Incidentally, 'The Hobbit' trilogy was filmed at 48fps and film 'Billy Lynn's Long Halftime Walk' (which bombed last year) and upcoming Will Smith film 'Gemini Man', due out in October, are the first two films filmed in HFR (High Frame Rate – 120 frames per second).

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 11

Bluebottle

I've tweaked that smiley - footprintssmiley - musicalnote again – I do worry that it is getting too long…

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 12

SashaQ - happysad

Looks spot on to me smiley - ok Thank you - very clear.


A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 13

SashaQ - happysad

Great to see this in Pliny with proper table formatting smiley - magicsmiley - ok

Just reading again, I wonder if you can strengthen the first paragraph a bit more. There is repetition of eg 'direct-to-video'...

The 'Despite many of the films...' paragraph seems a bit out of place - I can sort of see it is hinting at The End, but I wonder if you can merge it with The End and simply go into the tables after the mention of 'only the Tinker Bell series remained...'

"Americanisms such as 'trunk' when he means 'boot'." This sentence has a lot of 'snark', but it is fascinating that it highlights that that the rear storage compartment of a car either sounds like part of an elephant or footwear! 'Trunk' makes sense, as it describes a solid storage container that could be attached to an automobile, but I don't know the etymology of 'Boot' smiley - laugh

In Planes: Fire and Rescue it is Dusty that causes the fire?

The End section needs a bit of checking in relation to verb tenses and things but otherwise it finishes the Entry very well smiley - ok


A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 14

Bluebottle

Thanks for your comments, I've done some tweaking including moving and merging 'despite many of the' to the end.smiley - ok

By "go into the tables after the mention of 'only the Tinker Bell series remained...'" do you mean get rid of the paragraph containing a description about the Bechdel test and the smiley - footprintssmiley - musicalnote about PAL & NTSC? smiley - huh

Incidentally, a 'boot' is the step at the back of a smiley - pony-drawn carriage that the servant(s) would stand on – you can't allow them to sit inside the carriage, after all, they've got to know their place. Over time the little step gradually became bigger to also allow items of luggage to be stored there (it even became a little outside seat, but it is the luggage storage bit that's important).

smiley - huhIn Planes: Fire and Rescue it is Dusty that causes the fire?
smiley - okIn Planes: Fire and Rescue it is Dusty that causes the fire. Well, we all have accidents…

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A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

Post 15

SashaQ - happysad

smiley - ok

No, sorry I did class the paragraph 'Below is a summary...' as 'going into the tables' so that's good now smiley - ok

Thanks for clarifying about Planes: Fire and Rescue - the dangling clause indicated the Inspector did it smiley - laugh

Aha smiley - eureka Thank you - good to know that etymology, and shows more of the influence of carriages on modern transport, too smiley - ok


Congratulations - Your Entry has been Recommended for the Edited Guide!

Post 16

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Congratulations - Your Entry has been Recommended for the Edited Guide!

Post 17

Bluebottle

Hurray - don't you love it when someone takes the Mickey?

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Congratulations - Your Entry has been Recommended for the Edited Guide!

Post 18

SashaQ - happysad

smiley - biggrinsmiley - bubblysmiley - ok


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Peer Review: A87917728 - The Ultimate DisneyToon Studios Animated Film Guide: 2010-2015

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