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A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 1

Gnomon - time to move on

Entry: Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth - A619463
Author: Gnomon - time to move on - U151503

Another Tolkien entry


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 2

SashaQ - happysad

Thank you - this is a lovely Entry smiley - biggrin

I followed it well even though I am not very familiar with Tolkien's works. The only thing I had to re-read was the word Fellowship - that is a group comprising Sam, Pippin, Merry and Aragorn, is that right?

Excellent concluding section smiley - ok


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 3

Gnomon - time to move on

Thanks Sasha. I’ll clarify the reference to Fellowship.

This is the Avebury tree, but this picture is not suitable for the entry

https://flic.kr/p/KBG6Rj


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 4

Gnomon - time to move on

http://flic.kr/p/KBG6Rj


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 5

SashaQ - happysad

Wow, that is an impressive root system smiley - ok

This Entry reminded me of a fascinating tree I encountered last year A87913164 - trees are marvels indeed smiley - biggrin


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 6

Tavaron da Quirm - Arts Editor

Hi Gnomon smiley - smiley


My first impression is that this looks very good. smiley - smiley

'the third was taken by Earendil up into the sky and is still seen as the Planet Venus.'
I don't think this is quite correct in this context. We're not talking about Earth but about Arda, so it is not the planet Venus, it is simply the morning star, which is a shining stone attached to a ship in the sky.smiley - winkeye

In the section 'The Golden Tree Remembered' I wonder if you want to mention that after Galadriel left Lorien slowly looses its magic?

Do you want to mention the female Ents?

Anything worth mentioning about Doriath? Or the two trees of Gondolin?


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 7

Gnomon - time to move on

Not sure about Venus/Morning, Evening Star. Earth is the same place as Middle-earth. This is a mythological explanation for the bright star that is Venus.


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 8

Tavaron da Quirm - Arts Editor

Ok, I guess we just disagree on this then because that's never really how I read it all. I know it's what Tolkien wrote in the first drafts but for me it evolved to being a different place or a different dimension, whatever. For me it's not a mythological explaination but it just is the truth on Arda.


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 9

Gnomon - time to move on

Yes, we'll have to disagree on that one.

I don't remember the Trees of Gondolin? Which book were they mentioned in?


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 10

Bluebottle

Another entry I particularly enjoyed reading. smiley - biggrin

I did wonder whether it would be worth explaining that Sauron was Melkor/Morgoth's chief ally where you mention orcs, balrogs and smiley - dragons? That way people who've seen the films get to read a familiar name earlier up in the text and it also helps explain why Sauron was a prisoner when you first mention him.

Incidentally – and I'm not expecting this to be mentioned at all, I was just curious so had a quick look this morning – Tolkien's Father Christmas Letters smiley - santasmiley - simpost features a lot of smiley - xmastree drawn by Tolkien. For a start when the Polar Bear decides to cut down a smiley - xmastree he is punished by hurting his paw, which takes all year to recover, with smiley - santa saying 'serve you right'.
Also although the Aurora Borealis are 'Rory Bory Aylis fireworks', the faint glow seen in the north are the lights from Father Christmas's giant Christmas Tree, which he had taken from Norway and planted at the North Pole.

<BB<


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 11

Tavaron da Quirm - Arts Editor

The first mention of the trees of Gondolin is in the Silmarillon in the chapter about the Noldor in Beleriand, 3rd page in my edition. But it seems I remembered it wrong and they are in fact no real trees but works of art. There is a more thorough description in the Unfinished Tales, right at the start where Tuor comes to Gondolin, where he crosses the last few gates. There may also be a mention in the Fall of Gondolin somewhere.

And I thought about it but no matter how you turn things calling Earendil the Venus is just wrong.Both are two contradicting concepts of one thing that is the evening/morning star.


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 12

Gnomon - time to move on

Thanks, Tav and BB.

I've added brief mentions of the two trees of Gondolin. I had completely forgotten about them.

I've changed the reference to Venus. I still consider Middle-earth to be our world; Tolkien stated this in many places, such as the Preface to The Lord of the Rings. I'm happy, though to refer to the star as the "Morning Star" rather than Venus, leaving it to the reader to make the connection between mythology and the factual Venus.

I've added a mention of Sauron when talking about the defeat of Melkor. I then say later why Sauron arrived as a prisoner.

I hope these changes meet the approval of all.

smiley - smiley G


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 13

Gnomon - time to move on

Incidentally, I had considered making this entry about all references to trees in the works of Tolkien, in which case the Father Christmas Letters would be important. I decided,though, to restrict it to just trees in the Middle-earth world.

The reason for this is "Leaf by Niggle". This is a shortish work in which a painter tries to paint a perfect picture of a tree but keeps getting distracted by endless detail. It is an allegory for Tolkien's own life, as he was never happy that anything was finished and could never complete his major work, The Silmarillion.

This is a very different use of the concept of Tree, in which the Tree is a major work and the leaves are the details). It doesn't really match with Tolkien's love of actual trees, so I decided not to address it.


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 14

Gnomon - time to move on

I still need to consider the Entwives - I'm not sure if they are relevant since they weren't particularly fond of trees and preferred growing vegetables and flowers.

I'll have to re-read that section.


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 15

Tavaron da Quirm - Arts Editor

smiley - cheers Very good.

I agree that it is better to have one Entry about Middle-Earth alone. Maybe you find a way to make a 2nd Entry for other works with trees, if you like. But I think this one has a good length to read and I would not expand it much. smiley - smiley


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 16

Gnomon - time to move on

I think I won't mention the Entwives. While it's a good story, it's not much to do with trees, other than the fact that the Entwives weren't interested in them.


A619463 - Gnomon: Trees in the JRR Tolkien's Middle-earth

Post 17

Tavaron da Quirm - Arts Editor

ok smiley - smiley


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