A Conversation for The Dystopian Novel

utopia

Post 1

magrat

I was wondering if in defence of a seeming or (for lack of a better word) "wannabe" utopia, could the occupants create, or ignore the fact that they are in a dystopia? I'm saying this with reference to Alex Garland's The Beach, and I would be really grateful if you could help me.

thanks smiley - smiley


utopia

Post 2

Emily 'Twa Bui' Ultramarine

I've never read "The Beach" - sorry. Also, I don't quite understand the question... could you please rephrase it? smiley - smiley


utopia

Post 3

magrat

ah sorry, I thought I had phrased it a little weird.

say there's a group of people, and they think they are creating, are already in, utopia. In trying to defend this utopia, is it possible they could turn it into a dystopia? Or, is it possible for them to already be in a dystopia, and just ignore this, thinking its a utopia and they must defend it?

in particular, trying to defend this supposed utopia, they revert to militaristic rule, and inhumane "for the good of the group" type policies.

in, The Beach (which is an island):
On one side of the beach is drug lords growing marajuana, the other side the sea - in which there is shark attacks. Can "nature" as an opposing force to "civilization" actually form part of the dystopian elements? Or am I completely off track?


utopia

Post 4

sif

off track luv. you're thinking too much. how'd the assignment go?


utopia

Post 5

magrat

alyssa! back that up please! (don't hide behind "researcher number") smiley - smiley


utopia

Post 6

Mr. Cogito

Hello,

Well, I think this century has seen plenty of utopian schemes that have gone awry and become dystopian. Nothing quite the level of 1984, but there has been some bad stuff. Or as they say, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

Yours,
Jake


utopia

Post 7

Emily 'Twa Bui' Ultramarine

I don't think off you're off track at all. Thanks for rephrasing the question, by the way! smiley - smiley

As far as I can make out, it depends upon the individuals involved. To a marine biologist, the sharks would probably seem a perfect situation, whilst to a surfer it wouldn't. Same sort of thing with the cannabis growers. I think it is quite possible for people to turn a utopian situation into a dystopian one through trying to defend their utopia as people change their actions. People try to make any situation into that they think best - like the Party in 1984, who seem to think they are creating a utopia even though to us this is clearly not the case. I think this actually happens in the real world - look at Bush's intentions to drill for oil in Alaska. smiley - smiley

Sorry if that is completely impenetrable...


utopia

Post 8

magrat

no its great thanks smiley - smiley

I just wanted to know if it was okay to go along those lines in an essay.

thanks again!


Researcher 178202

Post 9

Whoami - iD dislikes punctuation

Hi. You haven't written about yourself on your page here yet, so this is the only place I can use to welcome you. I'm not an ace, I simply have nothing better to do smiley - biggrin than to be nice to people and welcome them. I see from your page that you havent written about yourself or given yourself a name - so it's hard for anyone to talk to you. If you give yourself a good nickname and type a short witty intro to yourself, then the community will be dying to come and speak to you! Bye for now, reply to this if you want to

Whoami? smiley - stout


Researcher 178202

Post 10

AgProv4

interesting. Following on the thing about Attwood's "Handmaid's Tale". It's a feminist viewpoint; it takes historical evidence of the status of women in western Judeo-Christian societies, notes the socially conservative nature of American evangelical Christianity and the disproportionate amount of influence it currently has over American politics and social values, and asks the obvious question - what if these people managed to take over the USA, what would happen next?

And she comes out with a truly disturbing vision of what the USA would look like if the semi-latent Taliban tendency in American Christianity managed to end up in power - and did this a quarter-century before Donald trump was elected to power. Here's hoping it doesn't get any more prophetic than that. Attwood focuses on the bad time women would get in such a society, pretty much to the exclusion of everything else - but the truth is - the Christian definition of Utopia would be pretty damn dystopic for everyone. Utopia for a few is Dystopia for the rest.


Researcher 178202

Post 11

AgProv4

interesting. Following on the thing about Attwood's "Handmaid's Tale". It's a feminist viewpoint; it takes historical evidence of the status of women in western Judeo-Christian societies, notes the socially conservative nature of American evangelical Christianity and the disproportionate amount of influence it currently has over American politics and social values, and asks the obvious question - what if these people managed to take over the USA, what would happen next?

And she comes out with a truly disturbing vision of what the USA would look like if the semi-latent Taliban tendency in American Christianity managed to end up in power - and did this a quarter-century before Donald Trump was elected to power. Here's hoping it doesn't get any more prophetic than that. Attwood focuses on the bad time women would get in such a society, pretty much to the exclusion of everything else - but the truth is - the Christian definition of Utopia would be pretty damn dystopic for everyone. Utopia for a few is Dystopia for the rest.


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