A Conversation for Non-Christians for Sexual Abstinence

Music

Post 21

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

Not very logical anyway smiley - evilgrin


But *why*?

Post 22

Ste

That's a very good point re: music, Blackberry. smiley - ok You also achieve a level of intimacy with musicians you're listening to and/or playing with...


"My parents might not be happy if I disagreed with them. And I've discovered that people get offended very easily"

But you shouldn't care that much. You should care if you care about the people in question, but if it means you hiding your true self "just in case" then it isn't worth it.


"I think I've already managed to accidently offend several people here on H2G2 by expressing opinions."

It's there problem, frankly smiley - smiley


<>

"Of what? That I am paranoid (you may be right about that)?"

Maybe paranoid is a little too strong a word. But something like that you may want to think about...


Take care smiley - biggrin

Stesmiley - mod


But *why*?

Post 23

Ste

(I can't believe I said "there" instead of "their". I hate that.)


But *why*?

Post 24

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

smiley - biggrin typos don't you hate them

Re offending people I can only think of 1, RF, and I can't understand why he was getting so upset about what, right or wrong, is obviously a personal matter and unlikely to affect him in anyway. Everyone else seemed prepared to offer advice/debate in a reasonable manner. I almost yiksed RF when he was insulting you after demanding and getting an apology from you.


But *why*?

Post 25

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

<>

I'm still thinking about it.




<>

It's better than getting them angry at me. And, after spending 11 years in a school system where I'd be beat up (verbally if not physically) for expressing most of my opinions, I'm quite good at concealing what I really think.


But *why*?

Post 26

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

<>

I also managed to offend "Master B" on another thread--I commented on Muzakboy's page and Master B found my opinion offensive.


But *why*?

Post 27

Jordan

Well, apparently I've been remembered here...

I wouldn't make a separation between physical pleasures and mental pleasures. The phrase 'mental masturbation' comes to mind - doing difficult things just because you can, and getting a hit out of it. Realistically, the only difference in physical and mental pleasure is that physical pleasure has a location; mental pleasure is just as real a sensation as physical pleasure, inasmuch as any sensation can be said to be 'real,' so a separation between the two is unnecessary.

That said, I have compelling physical reasons not to engage in sex. Based on the evidence I have, there is little likelihood I could engage in penetrative sex. Oral sex and anal sex would be unpleasant and I doubt I would enjoy them - there is, therefore, little point in attempting either, from my point of view.

Sexual touching and kissing are dismissed also. I enjoy tickling and being tickled; hugging and being hugged; giving and receiving massages; even kissing and being kissed. However, performing these actions in a sexual context is distinct from performing them in any other, since the former presupposes a sexual attraction between the participants. I have experienced what I judge a 'sexual attraction' to someone else very few times in my life, and seldom for a prolonged time - certainly not enough to overcome my inhibitions. At the best of times I do not like to be seen naked, further onus not to participate. Finally, the introduction of a sexual component into a relationship precludes a certain level of commitment if the relationship is to be maintained. This is not a commitment I wish to make, and therefore I see little point in initiating any.

I'd hope that by anyone's standards, this would be considered a rational motivation to avoid sexual intercourse.

- Jordan


But *why*?

Post 28

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

<>

Yes.


<>

You may be right there.


But *why*?

Post 29

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

Jordan

I agree with you that any seperation between mental and physical pleasures seems artificial. Some things like looking at a painting seem to be both to me.

So long as you're satisfied with your reasons for not wanting sex as far as I can see that should be enough to satisfy anyone else. You seem to me to have thought it through, but even if you hadn't its a personal decision.


But *why*?

Post 30

Jordan

Thanks, Blackberry! smiley - smiley I like to think I consider things carefully.

Lemon-Blossom, have you seen the Matrix? In that film, Keanu Reeves plays a character who is locked into a computer simulation, yet all his life he never questions that he lives in the real world. It turns out that what he thought were physical sensations were simply impulses being fed to his brain.

If you take the view that the mental world is entirely the product of mental activity, then it follows that pleasure is merely the result of certain patterns of mental stimulation. Physical pleasure may have its origins in the external world, but the actual experience is entirely due to events in the brain. The same can be said of mental pleasure. The only difference is in the origins of the pleasurable stimulation - in one case it's due to nervous stimulation, in the other it's entirely due to self-motivation. Qualititative differences exist between the two forms of pleasure, of course, since in the former you not only feel the pleasure, but can give it a location, it has a corresponding feeling. However, the essential sensation of pleasure is, so far as I am aware, no different.

Furthermore, sexual enjoyment isn't just derived from physical contact. Fantasising can have a similar effect, and often has very real physical implications. (Noticably in men!) Sexaul pleasure does not necessarily have a physical component, but even then can have the same effects - ergo, we conclude that physical pleasure and mental pleasure are not as well-separated as one might think.

If that is disputed, I would ask people to recall their dreams - an interesting exercise that demonstrates that the mind is perfectly capable of creating the sensation of physical pleasure on its own. On a deeper level, much of imagination consists of replicating (mentally) certain sensory perceptions.

The physical world and its pleasures are essential to existence, and by no means inferior to the mental world except from a purely subjective viewpoint.

- Jordan


But *why*?

Post 31

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

"Its better than them getting angry with me. And, after spending 11 years in a school system where I'd be beat up (verbally if not physically) for expressing most of my opinions, I'm quite good at concealing what I really think"

As someone who was bullied at school I can sympathise with that. The trouble is bullies (rarely physical) will continue to crop up in your life. Sometimes keeping your head down won't work. I'm usually a pretty non-confrontational person but if a boss or a lecturer is a bully, they'll see that as weakness. In the end you'll have to stand up to them.


But *why*?

Post 32

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

<>

Never seen it.



<>

Hmmmm...


But *why*?

Post 33

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

<>

Standing up doesn't work. At least not when the school administration consistantly sides with the bullies and the bullies love to play the race card (they're black, so anyone who disagrees with or dislikes them must be a racist). And it almost always works.


But *why*?

Post 34

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

Must admit when I was bullied it was not me or the school that stopped it, but the bullies older brother who threatened to give him a taste of his own medicine. It can be hard but some problems can't be avoided or hidden from or ran away from. I've tried all 3 at various times and the problem usually just gets worse, rather than goes away.


But *why*?

Post 35

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

Unfortunately, I agreee. It doesn't go away.


But *why*?

Post 36

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

And I must admit its easier for me to say the problem won't go away than to advise you on how to deal with it. Some people are just smiley - bleep


But *why*?

Post 37

Jordan

Quite. I did take undue pleasure in reminding myself that most of the bullies I knew would probably end up unemployed, living in council flats with four or five unwanted, foul-mouthed children, a drinking problem, a criminal record and a girl to whom a plastic rose constitutes a gesture of deep and lasting affection, and with a voice like a tortured rabbit on amphetamine (have you ever heard a rabbit scream?) - while I would be living in a lovely house of my own on £40K, with a garden and intelligent, well-mannered children.

Of course, I've forgiven them all now. But it's still nice to remember, when I'm having one of my more vindictive turns...

- Jordan


But *why*?

Post 38

Blackberry Cat , if one wishes to remain an individual in the midst of the teeming multitudes, one must make oneself grotesque

smiley - rofl sadly the type of people who bullied me are I suspect the idiots who phone up and start swearing if I can't find them a takeaway open at 4 in the morning


But *why*?

Post 39

Dark Side of the Goon

It's a basically admirable position you've taken there, Lemon Blossom. Plus, should you ever change your mind and decide that you wish to stop being a virgin, you can. Whereas, of course, the reverse is not true. So for that, smiley - applause


But *why*?

Post 40

Lemon Blossom (aka Athena Albatross)

Thanks for the support.


Key: Complain about this post

Music

Write an Entry

"The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is a wholly remarkable book. It has been compiled and recompiled many times and under many different editorships. It contains contributions from countless numbers of travellers and researchers."

Write an entry
Read more