A Conversation for The Romans in Britain: A Brief History
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ointmede Started conversation Sep 25, 2004
Hi Elentari - nice subject for an entry, but there needs to be a bit more work - the facts are out there, and easy enough to find. I'm apologising in advance for sounding picky, but...
"Britain experienced almost four hundred years under the control of the Roman Empire. It grew from a violent, Celtic nation full of tribes who were constantly at war with each other to a peaceful Roman province, populated by Romans, Romanised Britons and citizens (and non-citizens) of the Empire from many different countries. At it’s height, the Roman Empire encompassed hundreds of thousands of square miles and millions of people. Britain was only a small part of this, but the Roman period was one of the most influential in the history of Britain."
There isn't a great deal of information about the Brits before the Romans landed, just three or four sources. Yes, they were a warrior nation, but describing them as a "violent, Celtic nation full of tribes who were constantly at war with each" is a bit racy considering that every nation throughout Europe and beyond could be descibed as a warrior nation. If you want violent tribes constantly at war with each other, you may as well start with the Greeks.
Also, Britain was never a "a peaceful Roman province" - it was more like Iraq today, but with greater open revolt in some areas.
"the Roman period was one of the most influential in the history of Britain."
One of the most influential *recorded* periods maybe. There had been plenty of social change before the Romans arrived. Speaking of which...
"Julius Caesar was the first Roman to come in force to Britain. In the late summer of AD 55, while he was Governor of Gaul (modern-day France), he led an exploratory expedition with two legions1 and an unspecified number of auxiliary troops2. The Britons had assembled to meet them and the two sides joined battle on the beach. The Romans were victorious and the Britons asked for peace."
The date was actually the 25th of August 55 BC, at around nine in the morning (I kid you not). This isn't nit-picking, I just thought you might be interested. The reason for the smallness of Caesar's expeditionary force was due to the size of the army he had to leave in Gaul to deal with the constant rebellions there. It should be realised that Caeser naming himself 'Govenor of Gaul' meant little or nothing to the Gauls. The "Pax Romana" was about as solid and durable as the current "Pax Americana". Many of the Gallic tribes had not formally submitted to Rome. Trouble abounded, and about the last thing Caesar brought with him was peace.
The fleet he arrived in had previously been used to destroy the Veniti - a sea-going nation whose tribal area extended along the coasts of Britanny. In a sea battle the Romans destroyed the Veniti fleet and then went on the rampage, burning their townships to the ground and murdering the inhabitants. Please do not mention the word 'peace' and 'Roman' in the same sentence!
The British were also aware that Caesar was on his way - they had been supplying troops to Gaul to fight against him as soon as he proved a real threat.
"The Britons had assembled to meet them and the two sides joined battle on the beach. The Romans were victorious and the Britons asked for peace."
Kind of...You have to keep in mind that this account was written by Caesar himself (he always refered to himself in third person - sounded less like bragging). Caesar is quite unreliable on some matters, especially on the flora and fauna of countries he'd never set foot in. He related, in his 'Conquest of Gaul' the fact that in certain German forests there lived a type of deer the had no knee joints and had to sleep against trees. He also stated with authority that Britain was lacking in two species of tree (this is from memory, I can't remember which but will look it up) which are common in Britain now, and were common in britain then. This is a man who clearly can't spot when a native is taking the piss - his word shouldn't be entirely trusted.
You can also tell when he's going to win a hard faught battle, because he always 'bigs up' the enemy, increasing his own stature when he evetually wins.
What he describes in 'conquests', when you read between the lines, is an account of Caesar getting a foot in the door before having it slammed in his face. He describes a very brief landing, a half arsed retreat to a hastily constructed fort followed by a swift return to Gaul for the winter. He just describes it as his own choice, that's all.
The British were quite technologically advanced, too. Pliny, who visited in the first century B.C, not only comes to the conclusion that the Celtic plough was superior to the Roman design, but also goes on to describe the farmers using 'A big box, the edges armed with teeth and supported by two wheels, moved through the cornfield pushed by an ox; the ears of corn were uprooted by the teeth and fell into the box'
He's describing a combined harvester.
This might all sound like nit-picking, and to be sure, you've only given yourself a short space into which you're trying to fit an extraordinary amount of information, but I have to say, it's sounding a lot like the old 'For thousands of years people were brutal and stupid and then the Romans came along.'
The Romans were quite capable of being pretty brutal and stupid when it comes down to it. They just managed it in a more organised fashion, with embedded reporters.
Good luck with the articles, but please do some reaserch into what the Romans were destroying - these guys were nobodies saviours.
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Elentari Posted Sep 26, 2004
I wasn't trying to suggest they were, and actually I did cover Boudicca's Revolt and mentioned troubles the Romans had pacifying the province, so I don't think some of your criticisms are entirely fair.
On the other hand, you do make some good points. I have read Caesar's book, but you have to appreciate that I am only trying to provide a simplified and short history of the time and it is impossible to include all the detail.
However, I will look at the entry again and try to include some of your points and the overall tone.
Thanks for taking the time to feedback, I appreciate it!
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