h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Last week we were having a conversation with Jim Lynn about reviews, the stuff that needs to be done speedily because it is time critical. That conversation just seemed to stop so can we start it again now? The volunteers so far were Doug Dastardly, Marky B and myself but then we don't really know what is involved.

Lots of things could be involved. The idea has been on our RFC since I joined - being an insanely keen music bod I'd love to have a reviews section - but that plan involves voting systems, user review systems and so on, so that will take programming time, and lots of it.

In the meantime it's quite possible to set up a "reviews central" page, run by the reviews editors, and to create a bunch of guide entries with, say, "Review:" at the start. Then each initial review (see below) would have forums hanging off them in which other researchers could express their views.

The difficult bit comes in how - if at all - we incorporate forum postings into the articles themselves. Should the articles simply be factual blurb about the book/film/CD and then all the opinions should sit in the conversations? Or should the article be an amalgamation of people's opinions? And what role would reviews editors take?

I ask these questions not because I don't have ideas myself, but because h2g2 is the sort of community where the researchers' opinions matter immensely. Get back to me on this, and let's see if we can knock something together. I think it's a great idea, and I'm willing to put in the time to set up an infrastructure, not unlike the sub-editor one, to get it off the ground. Should be lots of fun.

How about the main article being a genuine review (the "best of" whats submitted on the subject), then having 2 discussions in the forum one in favour of the subject, and one against?

It would be fairly simple stopgap.

Anyone got any other ideas?

Okay, first thoughts are that there tends to be a lot of reviews of the same things in some cases e.g. Notting Hill or Phantom Menace, and these pages could be amalgamated into one article under the various sub-headings of who wrote it etc. I think reviews are bound to be more opinionated and it's important to retain that with the article so I don't think I could be happy turning it into a purely factual article.

I think the review editor's job is to a) create the amalgamated pages and b) ensure that there is nothing contrary to the RULES or slanderous in them and c)make sure they are not offensive. It is more of an organising job than editing but I think it might take a chunk of your back-log away!

Obviously there would need to be some way to pull allo of the different reviews together and I don't know how best that would be done. I'll try and draf MarkyB and Doug over here as they will also have some input.

I'm here, and I'll see if I can come up with something for later - at the moment I'm rather swamped looking after the cartoon's article (as well as trying to do my work!).

I'm here too!

The other option would be to create one paage with general guidelines for each subject (Film/TV/whatever) then just let people submit reviews by posting responses to it. So if lots of people wanted to write about Star wars theycould do so unter that forum topic. It would also stop people from being disappointed if their review wasnt put into the "main review" that would appear on the mainpage of the section.

I think you could find a good balance between fact and opinion - as Mark suggested to me earlier, perhaps format it like the other amalgam pages we have (beaches, alcohol etc.): factual first couple of paragraphs, then reviews underneath.

Every couple of days we could put something on the front page like:

Give us your reviews of
MUSIC: Chemical Brothers - "Another Load Of Bangy Noises"
BOOK: Alex Garland - "The Cult Novel"
FILM: The Spy Who Introduced Me To His Parents

with links for each, linking to the factual pages for each. Two days later we collect up the reviews for each, put them on the page, and suggest some more.

-- Yoz

That sounds wise. Post your ideas here, and when we've had a good blow-out I'll suggest a solution that hopefully will please everybody (which won't be carved in stone, of course). Looks like we could have quite a lot of fun with this one, especially as I've always wanted to write music reviews.

Thanks for resurrecting this, Ginger, you organising-type you. h2g2 is better off for people like you, and I don't mean that in a crawly, sycophantic way.

I actually run a music reviews site for a band called Wire and all the associated projects. Even met up with the ex-singer who now runs Swim~ Records a few times too. http://welcome.to/wireviews if you want a peek.

See I don't think we should pick what people talk about. There are already a lot of review type articles out there on books, films, TV, music, places to eat and drink. People are already deciding that they want to tell everyone about something and what we need is a way of speeding that through. OK if something big comes up then yeah, the method you are suggesting works (as it did with Phantom Menace, although I have to say I did not make an entry on that forum saying I thought it was crap because I would have been lynched!) but on a daily basis people read or see or experience things that they either like or dislike and want to tell everyone about it!

Had an odd time at the PM film. Went with 2 crazed SW fans and one person who'd never seen any, thus proving that SW virgins would have been thoroughly confused! Maybe try and steer people towards less known stuff like Clerks? Might be nice for some real indie stuff to get through to people.

That's the point I was trying to make. People don't need steering as it is their guide and they know what their likes and dislikes are.
(Saw clerks btw and didn't think much of it)

I thought the idea was to find a way of getting reviews of current/newly released films/books/music/events into a public forum quickly instead of waiting in the backlog of articles awaiting rejection.

Well, perhaps steer is the wrong word. No, steer is definitely the wrong word. What I meant was try to allow a broad range of things to be shown rather than just the latest blockbuster / certain number one. For me, the music press is the main enemy in this as it only looks out for the top40 these days, and the underground scene is really struggling to survive. Compare this to, say NME / MM in the late 80s when the indie scene actually got some coverage. Films are somewhat better off in this respect.

BTW, I'm not suggesting anyone should tell anybody what to see/listen to/ etc, just that it would be good to show as wide a range of stuff as possible.

Surely the reviews will just reflect the interests of the researchers who contribute. Sure the more "mainstream" films/music etc will get a lot more attention, and that doesn't make it any less relevant.

As long as there are a wide range of tastes and interests in those participating then I don't see it's a problem, the reviews will just be a reflection of the h2g2 community. If anyone thinks a fringe album for example deserves a review, there's an easy solution - write one!

I totally agree with that and that is often the more obscure stuff which provides the greatest interest!

I agree Doug, which is why I suggested that one page for movies (maybe more ie This Years/Current releases/Classics/Cult etc) which would general guidelines for what is included in the reviews, then people could post reviews directly to the relevent forum putting the title in the header. Anyone who disagreed with the review or wanted to talk about a particular movie can then reply to the review.

As you guys (Mark + Yoz) are planning a special review section sometime in the future, this idea would be an ideal stop gap. No-one could complan that we are taking too long to edit the reviews, as they will all appear instantly. No-one can complain that their favourite film/book etc isnt included beacuse everyone can submit to it.

As the movie title will appear in the header on the forum entry, I would presume that the h2g2 search engine would pick it up if anybody searched for info on a particular movie/show etc.

The review area editors, can put up whats popular (what to see/what to read ) based on the forum content on the main entry page. Possibly updating it every week.

If we go with this, we will need to come up with posting guidelines, and decide on the catorgories for each section.

The only problem with this is that threads will become very long because reviews tend to be long.

Oh, I'm not saying we should stop people reviewing anything they want to review, just that I think it's a good spur if you provide suggestions as well. Also, I've got a feeling that the suggested things are more likely to get a mixture of balanced reviews, as when you give people the option to review anything they like they tend (in my experience) to first go for their favourite stuff, which makes for good suggestions but doesn't give much balance.

-- Yoz