A Conversation for The Russian Language

The Letter ë

Post 1

the Shee

Why is ë not considered a letter? I mean, I always *thought* it was.... smiley - erm

smiley - peacesign
Shee


The Letter ë

Post 2

Pete, never to have a time-specific nick again (Keeper of Disambiguating Semicolons) - Born in the Year of the Lab Rat

I'd guess because it looks like ye ('e') with an accent on it. Mind you, the short i also looks like the normal i with an accent on it.


The Letter ë

Post 3

the Shee

Okay... Like che and n(tilde; sorry-- I don't have that key) not being considered part of the Spanish alphabet anymore? (I think it's those two.) That's just rather odd....

Thank you for the answer!
the Shee


The Letter ë

Post 4

Pete, never to have a time-specific nick again (Keeper of Disambiguating Semicolons) - Born in the Year of the Lab Rat

What are the actual Russian names for short i, hard sign, and soft sign?


The Letter ë

Post 5

the Shee

I'm not sure what you mean by "short i"--if you mean the pair to (oh shoot, I don't have the font on this computer!) the one that looks like a backwards "N" (ee), it is "ih"... um, it looks like bl, in rough terms (and a Latin font). That's the one that's hard to pronounce--like ee with a pencil between your teeth was one way it was explained....

The hard sign (looking like b with a little slash off the top--oh, these installed fonts are *awful*), is the tvyordy znak, as I remember it. The soft sign (b--no mark off the top) is myagky znak. As I recall.

Is that what you mean?

If I can install the Cyrilic font, I think I will, and then leave those letters here, because the Roman just doesn't do the letters justice.... Sorry about that.

smiley - peacesign
the Shee


The Letter ë

Post 6

the Shee

Oh, I know what you mean! You mean the two letters that both look like our N, backwards.... The one with an accent is a consonant, the one without is a vowel--they aren't both "i"s. That help any? ("ee"--vowel, and "ee kratkoye"--consonant).

Peace,
the Shee


The Letter ë

Post 7

Ricky Raccoon

Another reason why ë is not a fully fledged letter is that, when used in hand-written russian, the letter is simply written as e - the double dot is omitted.

Mir Miru


The Letter ë

Post 8

the Shee

Mm hmm... That makes sense. I never actually got around to learning handwritten Russian smiley - blush... I only know some of the letters. I can read printed things okay, though. (Well, except for recognising words... smiley - blush again) I haven't gotten very far in my Russian studies at all. I need to take a class; it is next to impossible to learn on my own!

La la la...

Peace, and thanks!
~the Shee~


The Letter ë

Post 9

Pete, never to have a time-specific nick again (Keeper of Disambiguating Semicolons) - Born in the Year of the Lab Rat

Thanks for the names... I'll see if I can spell them in Cyrillic.

The backwards-N with an accent is a 'semivowel', isn't it? Like 'y', or (more consistently) German 'j'. (Another semivowel in English is 'w'.)


The Letter ë

Post 10

Pete, never to have a time-specific nick again (Keeper of Disambiguating Semicolons) - Born in the Year of the Lab Rat

I just had an idea... there should be a version of this page written in Unicode so that people with the relevant fonts can see what the characters actually look like. Or otherwise somebody could make little pictures of the letters, or of the whole alphabet.


The Letter ë

Post 11

Nora - back from the Dublin meet!

smiley - biggrin *I* consider it a letter, but I've read a couple of sources that didn't, so I thought I'd better mention the confusion. I think there's every reason to count it as a separate letter, especially since they don't have it in Ukrainian.
Glad someone cares!

Sorry for it taking ages for me to respond - I'm going through my final year of Irish secondary school, which is very time- consuming. Checking in over Christmas after a prolonged absence in favour of homework.

smiley - strawberries
Nora


The Letter ë

Post 12

Nora - back from the Dublin meet!

I replied to the first posting without realising there were others! Dead right about hard and soft sign. I don't have the font either, which is one of the reasons I didn't put the names in the entry.

I didn't realise e kratkoyeh wasn't a vowel. Does anyone else find it hard to distinguish between the two "ee" sounds?

smiley - strawberries


The Letter ë

Post 13

the Shee

Heh... I don't speak Russian, I just try. smiley - smiley German and sign language (and of course English) are my languages of choice... I love Russian, I want to speak it, but I have to find a teacher... Somehow, somewhere... I have a lot of book learning, but no actual experience. smiley - smiley

I think it was Pete who replied right after me--I never saw those posts! Sorry...


The Letter ë

Post 14

Karvarii

Actually letter ё is considered to be letter along with й. Sound ё is actually a combination between sounds й and o. smiley - smiley)


The Letter ë

Post 15

the Shee

Erm.. those don't work in conversation forums (as you've probably noticed smiley - winkeye) You've just illustrated the problem I was having up above with describing letters instead of just *writing* them....

Are you Russian?


The Letter ë

Post 16

Karvarii

Yeah, I am. Well, at least that is what my passport says...smiley - blush Where are you from?

Describing some of the russian letters can be real tough. smiley - smiley


The Letter ë

Post 17

the Shee

Especially for Latin-based brains. smiley - winkeyesmiley - smiley


The USA... Great land. *laughs* (That's only funny because I don't believe the propaganda. smiley - winkeye)

Are you new to h2g2, then? smiley - biggrin This really is a great place...


The Letter ë

Post 18

Karvarii

Yeah, it's great... I can teach you some russian if you want smiley - smiley
But it would be easier if you had an ICQ or something that has facilities for different fonts... smiley - smiley


The Letter ë

Post 19

the Shee

Are you on a Windows machine? I can make it give me letters like ë, because those are also found in Latin-based alphabets... And if I installed the Cyrillic *font* I need, I could make the actual letters show up. But that font is not installed on this computer; it is on the one that doesn't have an internet connection. Anyway. The character map is useful, and the commands it gives don't turn into bunches of numbers.


The Letter ë

Post 20

Karvarii

You'll have to teach me thatsmiley - smiley.


Key: Complain about this post

Write an Entry

"The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is a wholly remarkable book. It has been compiled and recompiled many times and under many different editorships. It contains contributions from countless numbers of travellers and researchers."

Write an entry
Read more