A Conversation for The Controversy Surrounding the Origins of the Taj Mahal

Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 1

morningsky

Hi everyone,

I've several points which I'd like to express regarding the Taj Mahal controversy – hope you find them worth considering.

First, I'll address what should not be done, and then I'll state what should.

The Taj Mahal controversy should not be made into a religious issue. Making this a religious issue (with obvious political undertones) will spread hatred.

As I read through many of the entries, I couldn't help but sense an underlying anger, resentment and possibly fear of Muslims - as if to say that 'they are dangerous people, and we Hindus should stick together and protect ourselves from them.' It is not Muslims we have to fear, but terrorism, and, more specifically...WE SHOULD FEAR HATRED.

Whether or not some of you choose to acknowledge this is entirely your choice, but the TRUTH is that MUSLIMS ARE HUMAN. They are like you and me. They are capable of great love, great friendship, great artistic and intellectual achievement...and they are also capable of hate. Acts of terrorism or historical looting (as alleged in the Taj Mahal controversy) should be viewed as acts of HUMAN FRAILTY. It shows you what the human mind is capable of doing if it entertains thoughts of hate and selfishness.

Do you really want to promote more hate in the world? Don't we already have enough of it? If I see one more child die because of some act done by a religious fanatic, I will not blame the Muslims. I'll blame you, and me and our great 'educated' and 'civilized' societies, and our elected leaders - who had the voice, had the power to try to make inroads towards peace and understanding...but, instead chose to suppress, ignore or, worse yet, chose an act of violent retaliation themselves.

You've got to accept that they are real people, just like you and me. That's when you'll begin to see that we are just as capable of such human frailties if we allow ourselves to entertain and promote thoughts of hate. It is enough now, isn't it?

Now for the second point -- here's what should be done.

The truth is a powerful thing. This is not because it always turns out to be exactly what we want to hear...it obviously doesn't -- but, because it makes us face life as it is ...and gather the courage to make it better.

Assuming the controversy surrounding the Taj Mahal has sufficient archeological and historical merit, it should be evaluated and investigated. Failing to inquire into a charge of this magnitude (assuming it has merit) would be a disservice to India (and the world) because it would be an inaccurate record of Indian history. One could argue that the purpose of history is to learn where we came from, and shape where we are going -- and this would be impossible without the truth. Imagine if the great tragedies or accomplishments of history were not reported with accuracy -- there would be so little to learn from, and we may end up repeating horrible mistakes.

This leads to my final point - it is not enough to say that the mystery of the Taj Mahal must be solved...we as a society must be strong enough to deal with the truth, whatever the outcome may be. Are we?

The Taj Mahal is known the world over as a monument which inspires love. Should the story turn out to be false, are we now going to use it to support feelings of hatred? Are we going to use our new found knowledge to say 'well, I knew it all along...my religion is better than yours.' What a shame.

Or, will we say that we are proud to be from a country which suffered hundreds of years of political, religious, ethnic change and conflict - and yet has emerged today with a strong character, having undertaken a brave experiment in democracy and freedom for all people, regardless of ethnicity or religion. And, so it doesn't really matter whether or not Shah Jahan built the Taj Mahal or just took 'Tejo Mahalaya' – because, either way, he didn't stop India from becoming a freedom loving nation which has chosen peace, democracy and human rights as its highest ideals.

And, lest you forget– even if Shah Jahan unfairly seized it, he failed to prevent the magnificent monument from what would have been its ultimate destination even if the Rajputs had maintained it…becoming the property of the government of India.

A final note. India is NOT perfect, we all know that. But we've got to try to make it perfect - and we've come a long long way. India's soul is to be found in the spirit of compassion and love -- and we must protect this at all costs, for this is our strength. The most beautiful thing about India is its character. This IS a nation to be proud of....

What we can do -- spread messages of peace and hope. Help those who've suffered, to make the world a better place. Create a better world for your children - a world where there is less hate and more love (there were people who did this for you too, remember?). Know that as hard as it may seem, love is always stronger than hate. Support the truth, but also learn from it, and move in the direction of being a better person.

If you’ve gotten this far, you’re brave and I sincerely thank you for reading. Feedback is most welcome. Best wishes to all.


Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 2

Kal-ke

yes peace and hope is the only way forward in the age of the kali yug as i was full of anger for various reasons towards islam due to the actions of pathetic muslims who have left a terrorist view of islam on me......

but not just once EVERYTIME i encounter muslims they are always full of hate.....

then come the ones who are unfortunately in the minority who are OK but are obsessed with converting you.......

then there are the real minority that dispel any negative thoughts about islam until one of their idiotic brothers comes along again and ruins it all....

anyway check the below info out.....

my conversation with people wanting to blow up MECCA....

'why are people talking about bombing mecca when there are starving children around the world?

surely TRUE religion or philosophy would teach this rather than bombing holy sites......?

besides Islamic Mecca as it is today is only a recent thing.......

prior to that it was a VEDIC kingdom.......

mohammad smashed up the interior of the original temple and thus islam begun with destruction.......

however the actions of the past cannot be blamed on the people of today..
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i have a few questions for the muslim delegation here......

i) what does the 786 mean?

ii) if mohamed says that GOD does not have partners and rejected the Christian TRINITY - why is there the mentinon of angels in the QURAN?

iii) what is the story behind the black stone in the Kaba?

it would be great to get some answers without any abuse if that is OK?

i thought islam was a religion of peace until a muslim bragged about mohammed destroying the idols of the VEDIC temple....

after this was said i investigated into the rise of islam and it wasn't peaceful so how can the Quran be a mathematical miracle work of GOD?

i also found out that the TAJ MAHAL was NEVER built by Shah Jahan as it is 500 years older than his era so this indicates and further suggests that Islam through out history has spread its empire through the use of the iron fist.....

which is evil.....

care to answer my questions?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What is the black stone in the KABA?

kaaba link and 786 number......with photos....
http://www.geocities.com/jairama1/kaaba.htm

and another one......

What happened to Mohammed?
http://www.bibleprobe.com/mohammed.htm

The Taj Mahal really an Indian temple?

first a BBC site with this story.....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/alabaster/A5220

and then another more in depth site with photographic evidence...
http://www.stephen-knapp.com/was_the_taj_mahal_a_vedic_temple.htm
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i have chosen two neutral sites cos the Christian sites were really nasty and full of attitude.....

ALLAH was a PAGAN deity before Islam...
http://notendur.centrum.is/~snorrigb/fem4.htm

ALLAH the moon GOD...
http://www.blessedquietness.com/alhaj/append-5.htm

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

so why did the taliban want to blow up the BUDDHIST statues in Afghanistan?

not a military tactic to remove any proof that afghanistan was once indian land?

mmmmmm.....

to the muslim delegation - you have to understand that hindus have worshipped ALLAH for over 50 years.......

so why do muslims still have hatred towards india and her peoples?

ISHVAR ALLAH TERU NAM

a sentence created by Gandhi to create peace & understanding between muslims and hindus....

to suggest that if ALLAH is the name of your GOD then we will place him next to our GOD.....

http://www.geocities.com/chrishna21/ishwar.htm

i understand that the Muslims of India want to live in peace but why is there such hatred from others who label themselves as Muslim?

i am confused and hope someone can clear this up for me.....

Is Islam a religion of peace or war?

why did militants set of a bomb in india when india was helping pakistan during the earthquake crisis?

one really has to begin to wonder as to why there is such hatred from a culture or religon that is supposedly peaceful and its holy book is a mathematical miracle given from the almighty himself?

i would also like to look at the islamic version of the 786 -

any photos...

confused?

love, peace & TRUTH

The 3rd Side of a Koin..

oh yeah if you don't like wars & tyrants read the poem on the below link..

http://www.geocities.com/chrishna21/war_beast.htm

and if you don't agree with the war listen to this....

http://www.geocities.com/chrishna21/listen_to_the_karmic_music.htm


Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 3

ZafarMohammad

Answers to your questions...

i) what does the 786 mean?

A:- For true muslims there is no significance of no. 786, it is used as a substitute for the words "Bismillah irrahmaan irraheem" meaning In the name of Allah Most Gracious Most Merciful by some ignorant muslims, they count the no. of characters to form 7 and 8 and 6 for each word. I hope this answers your question, if not you can always ask and clarify your doubt.

ii) if mohamed says that GOD does not have partners and rejected the Christian TRINITY - why is there the mentinon of angels in the QURAN?

A:- In Islam, Muhammad (pbuh) is a messenger as was Jesus (pbuh). All messengers were sent by the same GOD, and we muslims call by the name ALLAH. The angels are mentioned in the Quran several times, but none of the verse describes them as the partners. They are the creations of ALLAH as we are. They worship ALLAH in the manner prescribed to them. Creations can never become partners, I hope this makes sense.

iii) what is the story behind the black stone in the Kaba?
A:- Its not a big story anyway, It was sent down from the heavens by angel Jibrail, and it was white at that time, The Hajj (pilgrimage) consists of touching and kissing that stone, it became black and black day by day, and today it is called as Black stone.

There are lot of misunderstanding which are present and still are spreading by means of hate. No person by himself loves or hates anybody, its the circumstances and things which happen around him make him feel and act.

As for as Tajmahal controversy, I don't like to argue on some research, bring me facts. I am not a fool like America to bomb on Iraq, saying my intelligence says it has WMD Hah.

Well I have a question now ........

Can anybody tell me from where the word HINDU came? because, As for as I know, there was this religion called SANATANA DHARM, I am amazed to know that no historian before this century used HINDU for them.


Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 4

Arsann

The word 'Hindu' is quite an old word. But using it in the context of the religion of the majority of Indians was the work of the British.

Actually it is quite fascinating to know that lot of 'Indian' terms have a foreign history behind it.

Let's begin at the very beginning. But one thing, I am following the general notion of historical flow, and not something radical.

We know that the Aryans migrated to the lands that we call India, Bharat or Hindustan from somewhere in Eurasia. This is the general idea agreed upon about the origin of the Aryans. While migrating, they settled down for some years in some places, and then again moved ahead. To cut a long story short, one of the first places they settled was current Iran, and there is no confusion that Iranians have Aryan ancestry as opposed to the other middle-east countries who have Arabic or Jewish ancestry.

Due to some conflict, a section of the Aryans left Iran and moved eastwards and settled down in the vast fertile plains of current northern India. The major rivers which they (?) named Sindhu, Ganga, Yamuna and the Brahmaputra. River Sindhu was their western boundary.

Periods and time passed, and the languages changed and developed locally. The Sindhu came to be referred by the western Aryans (Iranians) as 'Hindhu' or 'Hindu' and the place east of it as Hind. So, the people living east of the Sindhu were referred to as Hindu. This is the origin of the name 'Hindu' - a totally non-religious context. This developed further and the land of the Hindus came to be called Hindustan ie. Hindu + Sthan (place) of land of Hindus.

Next, I shall talk about 'India'.

When Alexander came on his world-conquering tour to India, the Greeks called the Sindhu River as Indus. They had Greek names for all Indian names like Taxila for Takshashila, Porous for the King Paurava, and so on. Ans so the name of the land near the Indus River was christened as 'India'. Megasthenes, the Greek traveller named his Indian chronicles as 'Indica'.

So, here we know that the word 'Hindu' has no religious connotation whatsoever, and that anybody from any religoin or community who resides in this land can be called a Hindu.
But the change came during the British era. Not finding a perfect name to describe the religion practised by people who were non-Muslim and non-Christian or non-Jain/non-Buddhist/non-Sikh, etc., they fell back upon the word 'Hindu' to describe them.

'Sanatan Dharma' might have been something too tough for them to write and pronounce, and it might also be a case of ill-advice by some native baboo smiley - smiley

But what we have is a word, describing a religion, which has nothing to do with religion.

To be truthful to the actual meaning of the word - anyone who is from the land of Hindustan is a Hindu, whatever his/her religion might be -Sanatan Dharma, Islam, Christianity, Jainism, Buddhism, Sikhism, etc. etc. nothwithstanding.


Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 5

kpjain6167

declare publicly that the doors of Taj will be opened and whatever will the conclusion will be accepted by all. In any cae Hindus have already accepted Taj to be Muslim monument and hence if it goes infavour of that community there will not be any backlash. Only the minority have always the problem in India and they have been pampered by congress for their own benefits.
Time has come that some one bold and strong in congress makes the history correct.
Those who have invaded India should not have their name on any monument, their name should be removed once for all and that should be the Supreme court judgement or Parliament act.
K.P.JAIN
smiley - bubblysmiley - cheers


Removed

Post 6

inathg

This post has been removed.


Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 7

psaint

Hey Zafar, this is really off the cuff. Was surprised at anyone having heard of the Santhana Dharma (not sanatana as you had earlier written though). It's really a traditional usage and hence cross references are in rarity amongst historical litreture. And thence I am surprised to come across another person at having heard of the Santhana Dharma.

cheers

PS: Even though I keep reading all the postings, I do not subscribe to having arguements over it. We have had the dan brown mystery on christianity, we also have the oak theory on the mughal architecture and vedic revellations (which is actually pretty old. I thought the controversy had already been buried). And come tomorrow, we would have another fresh revelation. These are probably good enough for lazy afternoon reads & for discussions. Not worth fighting our brains of.


Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 8

snowandflames

Dear Mr Arsann,

1. There was no such migration of "Aryans" from central Asia or Eurasia into India. This so called "Aryan Invasion Theory" or "Aryan Immigration Theory" has been refuted linguistically, archaeologically, genetically, chronologically.

2. However, it is true that the words "Hindu" and "India" are derived from name of the river "Sindhu". The persians, who could not pronounce "S" replaced it with "H". The British took it on them to popularize this word. The word Hindu therefore, was originally used to denote the people living to the east of river Sindhu. Today, it denotes everyone from Shaivaites, Vaishnavaites, Sakthas, Souryas, Buddhists, Jains, to Sikhs and even Parsees.

3. Sanatana Dharma is not a religion. It is amusing to note that the English language does not have an equivalent for many terms in Sanskrit.
Two such words are "Dharma" and "Sanskrti". They are erroneously translated to mean "religion" and "culture". The Sanskrit equivalent for these two words however, is "Pantha" and "Sabhyata".

Swami Chnmayananda says, "Dharma is one of the most intractable term in Hindu philosophy. Derived from the root Dhri, meaning to uphold, or sustain, support, the term denotes, ’that which holds together‘ the different aspects and qualities of an object into a whole. This is Law of Being; that which makes a thing or being what it is."



Taj Mahal Controversy - Here's What We Can Do

Post 9

snowandflames

Dear Mr psaint,

It is "Sanatana Dharma" and not "Santhana" Dharma.

Sanatana means eternal. Sanatana Dharma denotes an eternal set of rules and codes, which governs everything in this universe - material and immaterial, living and non-living, mobile and immobile, the subtle and the gross.

Anyway, it will again make for a good "afternoon read", I suppose

Cheers
S


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