h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

The Spanish are wonderful, Spain is wonderful, it's a pitty to be home, but less somkey (tee hee).
a friend of fish

I've noticed a few people have made comparisons between smoking and drinking- the oh- so convinving "no- one moans about people drinking" esque argument, but no- one seems to have pointed out the obvious....

If someone is drinking near to you, do you get drunk too? Does what they drunk somehow get into your system as well? I mean, can you passively drink? O.k, drinking is a personal choice, and so's smoking, but it's comparitively easy to force someone else to 'smoke'just by being in the same room as them.

I also must agree with the researchers who have pointed out that non- smokers should just stay out of the way of the smoke. Good idea. We could accomplish that by having more restrictions on where you're allowed to smoke- it's happening with alcohol, and those who are keen to point out the parallels between the two, I'm sure will agree with me!

And smoking breaks at work! Why do people who smoke get an extra allowance for breaks, whereas the rest of us get frowned upon if we spend more than a couple of minutes by the drinks machine. Maybe if I became an alcoholic, or developed some other addiction, I would be entitled to similar breaks?

Lastly, I don't mean to offend anyone, just stating my point of view, which is what this site's all about isn't it? So don't get nasty.

TK

But smoking dosen't have the same effects as acccessive drinking. If you've been smoking and get behind the wheel you don't endanger other peoples lives. Second hand smoke is, of course, not particularly pleasent, but unless one has an allergy or a condition that gets effected when one comes into contact with smoke, the tiny amount of smoke you breath really doesn't do much harm. Breathing the same air that someone is smoking in is not the same as smoking at all, but it is bothersome. I'm sorry if I was a little nasty before. It was out of place, this is just a very touchy subject, and I don't even smoke.

Of course, I believe people who behave irresponsibly while drunk simply shouldn't be allowed to drink, but the point is that the act of drinking isn't something which can be done passively.
Cigarette smoke is, it is known, carcinogenic- while it won't definitely 'give' you cancer, it does increase the risk. And cigarette smoke does damage the lungs- coating them in tar (and smoking passively does supply you with percentage of the tar, it doesn't all go into the smoker's lungs), meaning my lungs are affected when someone smokes near me. O.k, so crossing the road increases my chances of getting hit by a bus, but I at least choose to cross the road.

You choose to stand in the same space as a smoker in the same way as you choose to cross a road. If you don't like it, don't do it; walk away.

Unless you're exposed to secondary smoke day in day out over a very long period of time i.e. decades, it isn't any more harmful to you than breathing our already heavily polluted air.

Barbecued food is also a recognised carcenogen, so is practically everything else around you. Everything that you like doing, almost without exception, is bad for you. You can sit and worry about it if you like, but I'm getting on with it. I'm certainly not going to be the healthiest corpse in the graveyard, and I wouldn't have it any other way

I understand that a lot of things are bad for you, but if at all possible I'd like it to be my choice- rather than the choice of some guy or girl in a bar that I've never met... If someone eats a barbecued burger, it doesn't affect me, same way as if my friend has a pint of NonSpecific, it doesn't affect me (and vice versa, obviously).

On a different point- sitting in a bar for an evening, my clothes and hair end up stinking like an ashtray, but if I drink too much and puke on someone, they are effectively in the same position, but I am likely to be escorted from the premises, even though my act has affected one person (barring smell, the distribution of which is likely to be similar to that of fag smoke)

This is the trouble when people don't read the whole thread; the same old argument goes around and around.

Instead of moaning at smokers for stinking up your clothes and hair, why not moan at the bar owner for having crappy ventilation? Smokers don't like sitting in a stale smoky atmosphere any more than you do; they don't tend to moan about it for obvious reasons, but if I'm uncomfortable because of the atmosphere in a place I vote with my feet or open some windows.

With regard to you vomiting on somebody, I think you're an analogy too far there. Now if you'd spilled your drink on somebody; that would be closer to the mark, and though annoying when it happens it's mostly excused as it's a risk you take by being in a place where it's likely to happen.

I'm not 'moaning' at anybody- I'm putting forward my opinion and allowing others to comment. I'm not arguing with you saying you should be allowed to smoke, I'm just saying that why shouldn't I have the right to a relatively smoke- free atmosphere without all the 'if you don't like it, leave' crap. If I am doing something which offends/ upsets/ disturbs anyone else, they have every right to ask me to stop, as, I hope, do I if someone is offending/ upsetting/ disturbing me.

Out of interest, why do people start smoking anyway? Now please, before it starts, don't get abusive- I'm not trying to antagonise anyone, I honestly can't see the attraction beyond the peer pressure argument and I like to see all sides.

I find strong perfume offensive, but if somebody is stinking the place up with an overwhelming stench harvested from the anal glands of a musk deer, I tend to walk away or open a window. I've never heard of anybody asking such a person to stop wearing perfume and I don't see it as my right to do so either.

The worlds is full of intolerant people who want things exactly their own way and immediately too. I'll put up with people doing things that annoy, offend, upset, disturb me, in the hope that we don't end up in an Orwellian nightmare where practically everything is banned or made clinically 'safe'. Obviously everything has its limits e.g. if somebody was annoying me by murdering my parents I'd have to draw the line there.

I and probably everybody else would agree that it would be nice to have a relatively smoke/perfume/fart/exhaust fume/body odour-free atmosphere without all the 'if you don't like it, leave' crap, but you could have all of the above if the ventilation was better or you positioned yourself away from the offending person/persons and/or next to a door or window.

I'd say most people start smoking because of either peer pressure, an attempt to look older or cooler, an act of defiance toward parents, or experimentation. The reason they continue to smoke long after they want to quit is because it's so damned addictive and one or two cigarettes in the however many in a day 'hit the spot'. (especially after eating or while drinking.)

I also hate live bands and listening to people strumming guitars for hours on end, but I support their right to do what tickles their tackle as long as it isn't stopping me hibernating

Lol, very good
My guitar gets strummed only when I'm by myself in the comfort of my own room where I'm disturbing nobody, or when it's requested by those present.

And live bands tend to be advertised a good few weeks in advance, and not every pub has one all the time- just try finding a pub with no- one smoking in it!

Personally I extract a vast amount of enjoyment from cigarettes.
I also prefer smoking outdoors in public places as to inside my own house.

As concerns other people in the vicinity they have the option to move if they don't like it. Thats their choice as mine is to exhale noxious fumes.

How about this...

I am not against smoking. I believe in freedom to do what you want. However that includes the right to not breathe in second hand smoke when you choose to go out. It also includes the right to smoke without people moaning.

What about in schools? When I was at school, you couldn't go to the toilet without having to wade through all the smoke from the smokers in there. That isn't right, they're of an age to smoke, but its not really a fair place to do it.

Smokers in pubs aren't bad, you know what you're letting yourself in for when you go to a pub or club. But in toilets? Come off it!

If you want smoke-free pubs, you should go to Eugene, Oregon, USA. It is actually illegal there to smoke inside any place of business, bars/pubs included.

How about this instead; you have the right to expect things not to go your way, ever, and to expect other people to piss you off on a regular basis whatever you do and wherever you go. Having this philosophy will at least never lead to disappointment.

Personally, I didn't smoke at school, and those that did, usually went over to the bike sheds to do it. Maybe the boys at your school just liked hanging around male toilets?

I love this conversation because it's such a touchy subject. You can not smoke, but not mind smoke, you can be really touchy about smoke, you can smoke and be really touchy about it, and all sorts of other comanations. I love it.

Lately, I've been taking up the position of people should be alloud to smoke where ever and when ever they want to, but you know, I don't really agree with myself on that. I don't think people should be allowed to smoke in schools or places where people are eating breakfast. If there's one thing I really can't stand it's smoke early in the morning. I hate waking up, going to get a cup of coffee, and immidetly being sorounded with smoke. Also, smoke really clashes with my mouthwash.

You can't make smoking everywhere illigal, because that would be like prohibition (for those of you not up on your American history, that's when the American government made drinking illigal)and just crazy. However, there are places where one can smoke and places where one can't, and if one wishes to go to a place where smoking is alright, one needs to put up with the smoke, as it was one's personal choice to go to a smokey place in the first place.

Now you can all jump on me. Boy, am I excited (and that's not sarcastic, honestly).

Firstly, senwad, don't yell at me, I'm only ickle...lol!

Secondly, thankyou to friend of fish who put so eloquently what I couldn't get out in words! I agree, people who put themselves in line of smoke and then complain are just stupid!

Hey, slight conversation change, what about smoking grass? Whats everyones views on that...?

Kirp

Every study that I know of indicates that weed is far less harmful that tobacco, although I would not personally recommend breathing any kind of smoke to long/often. Further, unlike nicotine&tar the assorted cannabinoids are not toxic in any dose that has yet been achieved, even in laboratories. This does not necessarily mean that the grass you buy is harmless, as there are no quality controls on illegal goods, so who knows what it's been mixed with. In all, its pretty harmless as drugs go, but you're probably better off if you bake it in brownies or fry it in olive oil rather than smoking.

I don’t see what all the fuss is about with weed. Apart from anything else, the hemp from the plants is a useful, and biodegradable alternative to man made fibres. It grows like the proverbial weed, and could also be used as an alternative fuel source.

If you’re talking resin, rather than weed, then that’s a slightly different matter. Resin is easily cut with harmful additives. One British university, can’t remember which one, studied samples of soap-bar and found it contained a list of agents that would make even the most ardent of potheads think twice. The most common method of cutting is to fold plastic bags into the resin, but the study also found tar, pine resin, dog shit, diesel, opiates, cattle tranqs and a load of other nasties.

Personally, I think you’re better off smoking a spliff or two instead of drinking, but make sure you’ve got bud ideally, or leaf if that’s all you can get. Occasionally you’ll find some decent squidgey, but that’ll most likely be a by-product of your local grower, rather than imported stuff. Lets face it, you have a spliff or two to get off your head and it feels pretty similar to being drunk, only you’re not caring much about your problems, will eat practically anything, you’re the least likely person in the world to get angry and combative, you can’t have too much (all that’ll happen is you’ll trip-out), and you’ll be up and ready for work the next day without a hangover. Compare that to having ten pints of lager, and there’s no competition. Financially, physically and long term health wise, you’re better off with the weed. Legal prohibition is absurd and outdated.

I know quite a few people who smoke regularly and don’t suffer any ill effects. I don’t bother buying any; if a joint is being passed around I’ll have a toke to be sociable, but I’m not bothered either way.

Q:What's the difference btween a drunk driver and a pothead?
A:The drunk runs a red light, the potheqd waits for the stop sign to turn green.