h2g2 The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy: Earth Edition

Entry: Ireland and What to Call It - PR Version - A87859660
Author: Gnomon - U151503

A confusing subject.

Thanks for writing this - it is very clear and you certainly de-confuse the subject. It would be particularly useful for foreigners who are possibly not aware of the fact that Ireland consists of two countries, and for how long this has been the case.

I'm not sure you'll get away with "This ridiculous title" and "this dreadful phrase" - as apt as they are, they are subjective after all.

I notice that we have a series of 3 entries on the "Anglo-Irish question". There isn't anywhere to link to this, but it could be recommended for further reading regarding the division into North and South.

I must admit I'm with Gnomon on this one – they're definitely ridiculous titles and dreadful phrases. 'The Land of Ire' is just plainly, self-evidently dreadful. It's just like calling that place near Australia 'The Land of New Zea' or that place north of the Isle of Wight 'The Land of Eng'. What would the Falkland Islands be called under this rule? 'The Lands of Is the Land of Falk'?
Not to mention that as 'Ire' means 'wrath' or 'anger', 'Land of Ire' is just saying 'The Irish are very, very angry people' which is stereotypical at best, if not borderline racist.
One use is far too many – that is a fact.

'Atlantic Archipelago' is only mildly better. Still very, very, very ridiculous, though.

<BB<

Thank you for writing this - I agree with all your definitions. I remember one comedian who constantly referred to Ireland as 'the land of the bogs and the little people', but that's best omitted.

{This usage is popular with BBC reporters claiming British victories for Republic of Ireland sports people}

I'm sure you're right, but do you have any good examples? I'm not sure of their motives in doing this. Maybe there's a new policy of inclusivity since the power-sharing agreement, for example. A significant minority of the folk the BBC broadcast to in NI will have a close affiliation to the Republic.

In Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors, one of the characters describes his girlfriend by comparing parts of her body to countries:

In what part of her body stands Ireland?
Marry, in her buttocks: I found it out by the bogs.

They skipped those lines in a production I saw in London about 2 years ago.

Good stuff as always, Gnomon. Am I right in thinking that Eire is actually derived from Erin, which is in turn derived from the name of a Celtic tribe that arrived before the Gauls/Gaels?

Éire and Éireann (which was Anglicised as Erin) are the same word - one is nomnative case and the other is dative case.

We have very little information on who lived in Ireland before the arrival of the Christians (who wrote things down). For example Irish people started speaking a Celtic language (Gaelic) but it's not clear why as there is no physical evidence of any Celts arriving in Ireland.

Ah, that makes sense. Just did a bit of research and seems that what I've previously been told is based on a slightly famous "medieval pseudo-history" written by various poets. So 11th Century fanfic, then.

I've always thought that people of the Pictish type were the earliest modern humans.

Ireland was the last haven of the Heidelbergesians, who may have passed their distinctive upturned nose to modern humanity.

Prior to 6800 BCE, the Rhine still provided a waterwway connection overland.

This may not be relevant.

...earliest modern humans [in Ireland].

Great stuff. My partner is from Ireland and she bought me a short comic volume called 'The Xenephone's Guide to the Irish" that said that British people should never refer to "Eire" because it sounds insulting, though no-one can explain why.

Something that struck me reading an Irish newspaper was that Republic of Ireland football manager Martin O'Neil was referred to as a "northerner", and that seemed to be the term of choice for people from Northern Ireland.

I guess another source of confusion about Ireland and Irishness is around notable people born in Ireland prior to independence - so we'd think of Oscar Wilde as Irish rather than British and the Duke of Wellington British rather than Irish - or at least I would.

{British people should never refer to "Eire" because it sounds insulting, though no-one can explain why}

Maybe it's the appalling accent we use?

This is very elegant.

Thank you.

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